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Thread: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

  1. #51

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Can't you just put a washer on each bolt and raise the throw a little bit? Or bolt it down to a hard surface and bend the center of the base up enough to clear the center bead. there 's gotta be a way!
    Last edited by drummerMD; 04-05-2016 at 09:09 PM.

  2. #52

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Put rubber washers or nylon ? If it was me, I'd find a way.
    Last edited by drummerMD; 04-05-2016 at 08:51 PM.

  3. #53

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by drummerMD View Post
    Can't you just put a washer on each bolt and raise the throw a little bit?
    that's what I was thinking. Maybe use over-sized nuts for washers.
    SONOR 6 pc Special Edition 3007's red maple, old Pearl Brass 14x6 FF snare, Yamaha Tour Custom maple 8 pc., Tama 4 pc., honey amber B/B, Ludwig Supralite chrome 14x6.5 steel snare, Paiste, Saluda & Zildjian
    Loaned out Slingerland upgraded 4 pc 1963 black, wrapped maple + 14" Pearl birch FT
    The Almighty Speed King pedal, Speed Cobra, Sonor Single

    http://www.screaminmelinas.com

  4. #54

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by drummerMD View Post
    Can't you just put a washer on each bolt and raise the throw a little bit? Or bolt it down to a hard surface and bend the center of the base up enough to clear the center bead. there 's gotta be a way!
    I was thinking that too but do you think the contact with the center bead is an issue? Others who have upgraded to the P86 never mention having to shim up the throw off?

    Quote Originally Posted by drummerMD View Post
    Put rubber washers or nylon ? If it was me, I'd find a way.
    I think I found a way...swapping out the throw off on my wife's '70 Acrolite. I think she'll appreciate the upgrade and I'll surprise her with something was meant for me.





    Quote Originally Posted by slinglander View Post
    that's what I was thinking. Maybe use over-sized nuts for washers.
    Thanks, that's what I'm going to try but I looked into the P85 on my wife's '70s 5x14" Acrolite and found that the pin in the middle of the throw off never came with a "D" washer that I assumed was missing.



    I inserted the pin back into the throw off by inserting a flat head screwdriver behind the middle lever and pushed down on the pin with a drum key. It went in fairly easily which leads me to not trust it from falling out again.

    Last edited by late8; 04-06-2016 at 12:31 AM.

  5. #55

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Now we're getting warmer. That's my kind of p85. The on on the right. The one pictured on the acrolite. I believe those were from Ludwigs Chicago years. Has always worked well.

    all the best...

  6. #56

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    After inspecting the lever mechanism on both throw offs, I noticed better materials and better dies used to punch out the levers on the 1970 P85. The pin in the middle of the 1970 P85 looks like it's a bit larger and in my opinion, it may account on why it held up for so many years. I also noticed issues again with the 2010 P85 as I tested the efficiency of the throw off since re-inserting the pin.





    Last edited by late8; 04-06-2016 at 09:25 AM.

  7. #57

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    Quote Originally Posted by kay-gee View Post
    Now we're getting warmer. That's my kind of p85. The on on the right. The one pictured on the acrolite. I believe those were from Ludwigs Chicago years. Has always worked well.

    all the best...
    Now I know why you never had any issues. Your snare was made back in the Chicago days.

    I wish I could get my hands on a BB from the Chicago factory but I know they go for a premium if you can find one for sale right?

  8. #58

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Could be. You know how when companies change hands and move etc... Sometimes design and specs change. I'm sure for economic reasons as well. I believe even back to the 60's Ludwig was controlled by a company called Conn (Selmer, maker of brass instruments). Though they were HD'd in Indiana, their plant was on Damen Ave. in Chicago. (hometown of the Ludwig family) They did their own metal work there. I always considered those the glory days of Ludwig. At some point they relocated to their present site at Monroe NC. Don't know if it's run by different people or what. I am way less familiar with the products from there. I've always been a bit fanatical about Ludwig esp. the snare drums. William F. Ludwig Sr invented the snare throw off! (as well as the bass drum pedal)

    all the best...

  9. #59

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by kay-gee View Post
    Could be. You know how when companies change hands and move etc... Sometimes design and specs change. I'm sure for economic reasons as well. I believe even back to the 60's Ludwig was controlled by a company called Conn (Selmer, maker of brass instruments). Though they were HD'd in Indiana, their plant was on Damen Ave. in Chicago. (hometown of the Ludwig family) They did their own metal work there. I always considered those the glory days of Ludwig. At some point they relocated to their present site at Monroe NC. Don't know if it's run by different people or what. I am way less familiar with the products from there. I've always been a bit fanatical about Ludwig esp. the snare drums. William F. Ludwig Sr invented the snare throw off! (as well as the bass drum pedal)

    all the best...
    That's some great knowledge kay! Thanks for sharing. Good stuff.

  10. #60

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Thread resurrection... I bought a Supra that should show up this weekend and I plan on making the same swap to a p86.

    I've done the process before on a blackrolite I have since sold, but honestly didn't notice that it contacted the center bead. The shell on that drum was powder coated anyway.

    Given that the Supra is chromed and reading through this thread, I think I'm going to stick one of those adhesive felts (usually used on chair legs to prevent damaging a hardwood floor) between the throwoff and shell to prevent scratching. This may require slightly longer screws but that's easy.
    A simple, elegant design is good engineering.

    Axis | Ayotte | Evans | Gibraltar | Ludwig | Pro-Mark | Remo | Roc-N-Soc | SKB | Taye | Vic Firth | Whitney| Yamaha | Zildjian

  11. #61

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    I converted a 76 Acrolite from the horrible P-85 to the gloriously better P-86.
    P-86 packaging came with some thin nylon washers that sit between the strainer and anodised shell. This keeps it off the centre bead by a hairs width.
    Mine doesn't touch.
    Last edited by EyePea; 12-22-2016 at 09:56 AM.

    Acoustic & Electronic:
    Tama Superstar Hyper-Drive (Birch)
    Premier Artist Maple (with Birch Snare) - yellow/fusion.
    Ludwig Acrolite (1976)
    Roland TD-1KV

    Paiste Signature:
    10" Splash
    14" Dark Crisp Hi-Hats
    14" Sound Edge Hi-Hats
    16", 17", 18", 20" Full Crash

    Paiste Formula 602:
    22" Formula 602 Modern Essentials Ride

    Paiste 2oo2:
    22" Ride

    Paiste Sound Formula:
    20" Full Ride (Frankenstein)

    Paiste Twenty:
    16" China


  12. #62

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by EyePea View Post
    I converted to 76 Acrolite from the horrible P-85 to the gloriously better P-86.
    P-86 packaging came with some thin nylon washers that sit between the strainer and anodised shell. This keeps it off the centre bead by a hairs width.
    Mine doesn't touch.
    So that's what those washers are for? Thank you EyePea!

  13. #63

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    So I left the P-85 off and very satisfied with the P-86 upgrade. Here's a pic:


  14. #64

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Can't quite get the camera on the correct angle; but I swear it's just off the bead.

    Last edited by EyePea; 12-22-2016 at 09:52 AM.

    Acoustic & Electronic:
    Tama Superstar Hyper-Drive (Birch)
    Premier Artist Maple (with Birch Snare) - yellow/fusion.
    Ludwig Acrolite (1976)
    Roland TD-1KV

    Paiste Signature:
    10" Splash
    14" Dark Crisp Hi-Hats
    14" Sound Edge Hi-Hats
    16", 17", 18", 20" Full Crash

    Paiste Formula 602:
    22" Formula 602 Modern Essentials Ride

    Paiste 2oo2:
    22" Ride

    Paiste Sound Formula:
    20" Full Ride (Frankenstein)

    Paiste Twenty:
    16" China


  15. #65

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by EyePea View Post
    Can't quite get the camera on the correct angle; but I swear it's just off the bead.

    Wow...nice shot!

  16. #66

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by late8 View Post
    So that's what those washers are for? Thank you EyePea!

  17. #67

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    I replaced a faulty P85 with a P86 on my 5 x 14 BB years ago but I don't remember having any center bead issues. I must have used the included nylon washers to shim the throw off.

    In any case, replacing a faulty P85 with a P86 is the best option for a Ludwig snare IMO. Mine has worked flawlessly for years.

    I believe that the first P86s that came out had some issues but Ludwig resolved that pretty quick.

    Glad everything worked out for you ...
    Last edited by dangermoney; 12-22-2016 at 10:10 AM.

  18. #68

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by dangermoney View Post
    I replaced a faulty P85 with a P86 on my 5 x 14 BB years ago but I don't remember having any center bead issues. I must have used the included nylon washers to shim the throw off.

    In any case, replacing a faulty P85 with a P86 is the best option for a Ludwig snare IMO. Mine has worked flawlessly for years.

    I believe that the first P86s that came out had some issues but Ludwig resolved that pretty quick.

    Glad everything worked out for you ...
    Thanks man!

  19. #69

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Just added a P86 to my World Max. It worked out great,had to drill new holes at 2 1/2" for the Ludwig throw. The world Max is 1 1/2". Just put flat plastic blk push caps in and silicone and made a upper and lower rubber gasket for the P86 and the caps are totally hidden.

  20. #70

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    ^^Very nice mod Doc! Can't see the plugs, nice job!!

  21. #71

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by dangermoney View Post
    I replaced a faulty P85 with a P86 on my 5 x 14 BB years ago but I don't remember having any center bead issues. I must have used the included nylon washers to shim the throw off.

    In any case, replacing a faulty P85 with a P86 is the best option for a Ludwig snare IMO. Mine has worked flawlessly for years.

    I believe that the first P86s that came out had some issues but Ludwig resolved that pretty quick.

    Glad everything worked out for you ...
    Thank you. Best throw off besides the aftermarket types!

  22. #72

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by late8 View Post
    Thank you. Best throw off besides the aftermarket types!
    You're quite welcome ...

  23. #73

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by EyePea View Post
    P-86 packaging came with some thin nylon washers that sit between the strainer and anodised shell. This keeps it off the centre bead by a hairs width.
    Mine doesn't touch.
    Never even thought about it touching...............going to have to check my supra.

    I am also a big fan of the 86

  24. #74

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    It's crazy how some guys swear by the P85 and have ones they have used without problems for decades and some others have had nothing but problems with them. I've had 3 different ones totally lock up on me on different drums. We have a few Acrolites where I teach and we're always having to fuss with them. I love the P86, but 45 MORE dollars for something that should be standard on some of the best sounding snares in the business seems petty from Ludwig.

  25. #75

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    Default Re: Ludwig P85 Snare Strainer Fail

    Quote Originally Posted by Redeye View Post
    It's crazy how some guys swear by the P85 and have ones they have used without problems for decades and some others have had nothing but problems with them.
    Yep, crazy ...

    P85s are hit and miss and the older ones are typically more reliable than the newer ones. Simple fixes for some of the more common issues are well documented. Once you get one that works, or one that you can fix and get working, it will usually work reliably forever. If not, it's a lemon and the best option is to replace it with a P86 ... that has been my experience anyway ...

    My personal favorite is the P83 but those are expensive and a bit harder to find ...

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