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Thread: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

  1. #1

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    Default 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    For some reason, I decided to build (as opposed to buy) a snare to match my jungle kit. I wanted a smaller diameter for easy placement behind the small kit, but deep to add projection and hopefully more mellow tone. I was planning on using a 12x8, but I found that 13" is more common for stuff like snare wire and head selection. Plus, 12" seems to create issues with my snare stand adjustment. I found an old used Rogers 13x9 tom for $19. It's the imported R360 model with Luan shell....but do is the rest of my kit, LOL. The shell is actually pretty well made. It's nice & thick, plus it has a reverse round-over bearing edge which should make it interesting. Best of all, the lugs are exact duplicates of the "Pearl stencil kit" that are on my jungle kit, but they're very solid & heavy castings. The goal is to have it done in time for the gig next weekend.

    STEP 1:
    I pulled off the old wrap and sanded the glue off the shell. (Yes, the wrap was actually fully glued). There was some outer ply separation, but it was there when new. The factory actually nailed down the end of the outer ply using brass tacks, LOL. I glued it back in place, then I plugged the holes from the Pearl style tom mount using hardwood dowels.


    This weekend, I'll paint the interior with specked auto trunk paint (like the rest of my kit) and work on fixing up the bearing edges. Then I'll try my hand at cutting a snare bed. More info to follow...
    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  2. #2

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    A 3/8" coarse rat tail file will cut the beds perfectly---then sand them smooth, and you are good to go!

  3. #3

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    The tom to snare conversion is a really fun project. Just be patient when cutting the snare bed, and don't go too deep. When I did my 14x10, I cut snare bed 1/8" deep, using a half-round file and sandpaper. It turned out great. Have fun with it!
    Aut Viam Inveniam Aut Faciam
    "I shall either find a way or make one"

  4. #4

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    Anyone have any specifics in terms of how far up from the bottom bearing edge the throw off and butt plate should be? Seems like there should be an optimum break angle that the snare cord should be at....maybe 45*? The farther up the shell, the greater the break angle the cord will have have against the hoop. That will have an effect on the tension and forces applied to the snare wires. My instincts tell me the butt plate (fixed side) should be lower for more of a direct pull and the throw-off a little higher for more mechanical advantage. If it's too high, I could see it creating a binding issue wher the cord breaks angle over the hoop. I guess I could just duplicate an existing snare, but the engineer side of me says there may be some advantages available.
    Last edited by N2Bluz; 07-02-2016 at 12:28 PM.
    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  5. #5

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    Wow. You're putting a lot more thought into it than I did. LOL I just looked at my other snares and pretty much replicated the average distance on them. It worked out great. FYI, I used a DW Mag throw-off, with the 3 position adjustable butt plate. It's amazing!
    Aut Viam Inveniam Aut Faciam
    "I shall either find a way or make one"

  6. #6

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    Well, I tend to overthink things, LOL. I searched all over the net. Nowhere did I find anything about distance from the bearing edge. I'm going to assume it doesn't make much difference. Tomorrow, I'll measure my Tama & Maxwin steel snares and just duplicate it. I thought about the DW stuff, but it's too expensive for cheap Taiwan drum. My PDP has the mag throw, and although it works sweet. It sticks out a lot. It always catches on things and BARELY fits in my drum bag. I may try the 3-pos butt plate however on my PDP. I bought the Gibraltar classic deluxe stuff for this project.

    Tonight I made it through STEP #2. I trued the bearing edges on my glass plate and cut the snare beds by hand using a rigid steel ruler wrapped with 150 grit sand paper. I made them 3/32" deep X 3" wide. Then I gradually tapered the bed out to just past the adjacent lugs on each side. That seems to be the most common profile and should allow for the use of up to 24 strand wires without any pitch on the end plates. I must say, it looks like a factory snare bed. If I experience issues with wrinkles in the head, I can always extend the taper out farther. For snare wires, I ordered a set of cheap ($11) Pearl 20-strand. I'm thinking of removing the center 8 wires to make it similar to the Puresound "equalizer" design, but I'll try them "as is" first. If I like the snare, I can always upgrade the wires, hoops, etc.. I hate to spend too much money or labor without a test run.
    Last edited by N2Bluz; 07-03-2016 at 01:29 AM.
    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  7. #7

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    Awesome. Sounds like you definitely have a handle on it. I couldn't really find any definitive info on throw-off placement either.

    I put 20-strand Puresound snare wires on my 14x10, and I've also thought about cutting out some of the center wires. I'm undecided.
    Last edited by Powertrip240; 07-03-2016 at 06:51 AM.
    Aut Viam Inveniam Aut Faciam
    "I shall either find a way or make one"

  8. #8

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    The higher the throw and butt, the more string you need to use.
    click to see my kit re-veneer/finish
    http://www.drumchat.com/showthread.p...168#post379168

  9. #9

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    Tuned in. I love DIY projects like this. Can't wait to see the final product.

    Pics, Brian...lots and lots of pics...

    Tex

  10. #10

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    I'm excited for you. Should be an awesome instrument when you're done. That's a great size. Power Piccolo!
    I've created a snare from a 12" x 8" Roger's 1971 Powertone tom, and I love it. The wrap is awesome on that drum so I didn't have to do anything like what you're up to. Interior is already factory coated as well. I was buying a 13 x 7 OCDP from a guy who happened to have the Roger's shell partway through the conversion. Best $30 spent ever.
    I also turned an old 16" concert tom into a massive 16 x 7 snare. I call it the MEGA snare. Custom wrap from BumWrap; blue poison dart frog. Amazingly unique and useful instrument.
    Here's a pic of my girls. The Roger's is on the top right. I think you can find the 16" one. More importantly, you can see the Gibraltar throw I chose for both of them. For the price, you can't beat this thing, IMO.


    Snare drums you make yourself, even if it's from an old tom, mean more to you than when you just fork over cash for something 1000's of other players have, too. (Unless it's a BB lol)
    Keep us posted of your progress.
    Proudly playing:
    Doc Sweeney Drums
    A bunch of snares
    A bunch of cymbals

    Off-Set double pedals

    I think I love to play the drums simply because you get to hit 'em!!!

  11. #11

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    Got the shell drilled for the throw-off and butt plate today.



    We've had rain all weekend, so I couldn't get the interior of the shell coated with trunk paint. I still need to clean & polish the lugs as well. I picked up an Evans Hazy300 reso and a coated G1 for the batter. The snare side hoop and snare wires should be here tomorrow in the mail. It was a little challenging finding a 13" 6-lug snare side hoop. I'm planning on cleaning up and re-using the old wrap. I'll patch the old Pearl style mount holes with a piece of an old wrap from another drum (I save everything), then I'll apply the adhesive backed vinyl over the top of it. When I built my jungle kit, I bought enough of the "engine turned" silver (like on my 8" tom) to do a snare. I figured I may eventually do this project. I could paint it turquoise like the bass and FT, but the engine turned aluminum with give the snare some "bling"...and it will look good with any kit I decide to use it on.
    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  12. #12

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    What are you planning on doing for a stand? I have a 13x8 snare I have one snare stand that goes low enough for it.
    "The problem with information on the Internet is that you can not validate it's authenticity. " -Abraham Lincoln

    SILVERFOX DRUMSTICKS & SOULTONE CYMBALS Endorsing Artist.

  13. #13

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    Quote Originally Posted by EddieV View Post
    What are you planning on doing for a stand? I have a 13x8 snare I have one snare stand that goes low enough for it.
    That's definitely a concern and something I'm working on. Another reason I bought the 13x9 shell instead of using a 12x10 shell I already had. My 12x5 Pork Pie snare just barely works with my existing Pearl snare stand. By the time I adjust the vertical screw basket small enough for the 12" diameter, it raises the height to much. The 13" diameter will help in that respect. It should compensate for maybe 1" but the additional 2" of extra height will still be a problem. I'm going to stop at the used store today and look for a light duty snare stand that I can cut down. I'm thinking maybe one with basket arms that slide out to adjust for drum diameter....and hopefully a center tube that I can cut down or modify. My snare height is typically between 28" to 30" from floor to batter head, so I think I can figure out how to make it work. (Fingers crossed).
    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  14. #14

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    Snare is looking good Brian. Thanks for all of the details and the pics.

  15. #15

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    looking good! Nice work filling in the holes

  16. #16

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    Makes me want to take on a project myself
    Quote Originally Posted by rickthedrummer View Post
    There is intelligent life out there. The problem is that there isn't any here.

    -Mike

  17. #17

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    I double checked the stand height issue. Currently, my 14x6 Tama is 27.5" from floor to top of the batter rim. Using the single braced Tama stand I already have, I can drop it down to 24". That means 27" will be the minimum for the 9" deep snare if I just set it on the basket and don't try to adjust it up to grip the smaller 13" diameter. If I do adjust it, it will probably put it around 28". I think I can live with that. I could raise the throne a touch as well. Depending on how the stand is made, I might be able to cut the main tube down as well.
    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by N2Bluz View Post
    I could raise the throne a touch as well.
    That's what I ended up doing......
    "The problem with information on the Internet is that you can not validate it's authenticity. " -Abraham Lincoln

    SILVERFOX DRUMSTICKS & SOULTONE CYMBALS Endorsing Artist.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by signia fan View Post
    The higher the throw and butt, the more string you need to use.

  20. #20

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    LOL, actually I'm more of a "strap" man, myself......
    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  21. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by N2Bluz View Post
    LOL, actually I'm more of a "strap" man, myself......

  22. #22

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    Default Re: 13x9 tom to snare conversion project

    For anyone wondering, here's what I use to coat the interior of the shell. It works excellent, but takes a couple days to fully cure. Once it hardens, it's very hard and durable. It looks very close to the old Ludwig Granitone, but is just SLIGHTLY rougher. I used it on the shells of my jungle kit, and they sound very good....especially for being bottom of the barrel Luan wood. Punchy, tight and warm, with great low end and projection. Very similar to my old Japan made Tama Swingstars. I would recommend it to anyone that has an old, cheap junk wood kit they're fixing up. It's easy to build up the thickness, which means it not only adds strength to the shell, but also covers and hides blemishes in the surface. This makes it ideal for hiding hole plugs and other repairs made to the shell. For this reason, I'll probably use it on the old Ludwig shells on my next project.

    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  23. #23

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    Managed to get the shell interior painted over my lunch break. Tonight, I'll polish the lugs and hoop, then work on cleaning up the old wrap. I hope to start assembly tomorrow night and be able to mess with tuning it on Friday night. That gives me some time if I need to do more work on the bearing edges or snare bed. If I can get the sound right, I'll take it to the gig on Saturday....but I'll also bring another snare as backup.
    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  24. #24

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    Pic of the shell after interior paint...

    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

  25. #25

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    Got the old wrap cleaned up and ready to re-install. I cut out the area of the tom mount bracket and made a patch from another old wrap I had laying around. Much easier to make a patch for a large square area, as opposed to patching 4 round holes. Also, it will be less noticeable under the vinyl over-wrap. I used strips of wide masking tape applied to the back side of the blue wrap to act as backing support. Then, I placed the patch piece in position and the masking tape held it in place. Next, I used CA glue around the joint edges to weld it in place as well as fill in the gaps. It actually worked way better than I had hoped. Once I sand the joints down flush, you'll never be able to tell there's a patch. I'll use medium strength spray adhesive to glue the old wrap back on the shell and double sided carpet tape on the wrap seam.



    Here's a good view of the snare bed
    -Brian

    "Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"

    Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!

    "I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham

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