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In my practice session earlier today, I found out how to heel/toe, something that I've wanted to do for quite some time. I was wondering what kind of exercises I could do to improve the technique. All I did was establish some muscle memory during my session.
Good job! can you share how you did it? Or is that only possible from a real live person in person?
Hmm. How can I explain it lol. Let's see. I had my foot waaay up on the pedal, like with my toes up against the chain and I was experimenting with playing heel up. I just happened to hit down just right and my heel bounced on the pedal and I got the second hit. I went back and tried again and found my pedal's sweet spot. It's kinda hard since I don't have a longboard and my feet aren't the size of my 12 year old sister's :laugh3:
That probably doesn't help too much, but it's kinda hard to describe. I'll see, maybe I'll have an opportunity to post a video of it for you in the next few days or so.
Derrick Pope has a youtube vid of this that explains very well. I have also seen this vid in the video lessons here on DCQuote:
Originally Posted by DrumRookie
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSKS9a9NuPc"]YouTube - Derrick Pope - Heel Toe Method[/ame]
I started out with heel-toe, mostly because it was the easiest for me. So I purchased a longboard. After you develop the working muscles needed, it becomes easier to do it on a regular pedal without having to put your toe so close to the chain/belt.Quote:
Originally Posted by NoiseInMotion
If you have a high arch:
I basically have the St. Louis arch in my foot and I don't wear shoes while playing. One thing I noticed that was particularly helpful for me. If I move my foot a little towards the left (right edge of my foot closer to the center of the pedal), it's much easier for me to do.
Keep working on it, it will become easier and faster :punk:
Heel/toe is a great technique that can give you a ton of new ideas. It can mimic the quick doubles that John Bonham used in 'Good Times, Bad Times' and you can add complexity to stale straight double kick drumming with double strokes.
How do you work on it? Practice it.
You don't even need a pedal to practice heel toe. I practice it on the ground whenever I can. You sit in a chair, stomp the ground with your heel and while pulling up your leg rotate the ball of your foot down and tap your toes on the upstroke. I can even do it while standing, and often do (probably bothering people around me in the process but I don't care!). Practice, practice, practice.
I've been doing that all morning :bigrin:Quote:
Originally Posted by Nechre
I mimic trying to "tap dance" while seated. It drives strangers crazy when I'm in a waiting room (i.e. the doctor's office) and I find myself practicing my heel/toe technique. I get strange and annoyed looks as my feet "spaz out" back and forth lol...
i gotta learn this..i known about it for years, but i've never actually tried it, it would prolly save a lot of energy when doin fast double bass rhythms
Yesterday I watched Popes lesson on heel toe..and maybe I have the wrong pedal ( basic Tama ) but my pedal will not allow..my foot is 12" long and when I place it flat on pedal and rock my heal is off the back side and will not bounce pedal...Now I am considering a double pedal and I have read the threads there..but..would you think this is a pedal problem or adjustment problem?? can't see any real adjustment to change my foot length..thoughts??
Ditto but makes me laughQuote:
Originally Posted by late8
You can do heel/toe on any pedal. The key is foot placement. In an effort to incorporate this technique into most of my playing, I started playing heel up and I keep my toes as far up the pedal as they'll go so my heel hits right above where the foot base ends. I use an Iron Cobra Jr. and a single Iron Cobra (depending if I'm on my home kit or my band's practice kit) and this works great for me. Despite the fact that I think I have smaller feet (I never bothered to measure them before lol), I think this would work for you too. Here's a top down view of my ICJ pedal to give you a better visualization of what I'm talking about. Excuse the beater xDQuote:
Originally Posted by MartyM
http://i863.photobucket.com/albums/a...f/SAM_1154.jpg
As far as the actual technique goes, the best thing you can do to practice is what the other people in the thread have been saying: rock your feet back and forth to produce sort of a galloping sound anywhere you're sitting. It gets annoying to other people after a while (I usually only do it in small spurts or when there's lots of noise so it's not as noticeable), but this really helps. I've done more heel/toe sitting in class than I have sitting at my kit lol
great work on getting your heel toe sorted out the best way to practice i found is just in a normal 1/4 note groove in 4/4 and use the heel toe technique on the kick for the 1 + and the 3 + of the beat :)
i have an iron cobra jnr double pedal try using the ball of your foot for the second hit rather than your toes it works for me and i have UK size 12 feet :)Quote:
Originally Posted by MartyM
it also stops your toes rubbing against the chains :)
Thanks guys...I will try tonight...you see if I push my foot forward to get heel on back of pedal my toes are into the chain!!! so maybe as suggested I will have to move my foot front to back to adcheive the desired rocking...ty
Good tips guys...as always. I'm finally gonna give this a shot.
Yeah I need to get going on the heel/toe. I have tried it a few times and can hit it sometimes and miss it other times, I just haven't given it the time it deserves...It's time.
Sounds good! Personally though I think as we start to develop we all create unique techniques that best work for us. Even if it's just small variations of 'correct' techniques.
Glad you said correct as there are a lot of bad habits out there. Well doneQuote:
Originally Posted by ludwigkid
I have the same problem Marty. I understand the concept, but my size 12 foot and my footboard just don't agree with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by MartyM
If you play with shoes, try practicing heel/toe with socks. The rubber soles on most shoes will hamper the rocking back and forth action when you first attempt this technique and with the shoes off, you have a bit more room to manuver your foot towards the chain.Quote:
Originally Posted by DrummerD
+1. I always play in socks. Shoes really get in the way of "feeling" the pedal and inevitably lead to foot creep.Quote:
Originally Posted by late8
I have made some progress with heel toe myself this past week. Spending even 5 minutes out of your practice session to do nothing but heel toe really builds the muscle memory for it. I have now moved on to adding tom beats after a double bass hit, nothing too fancy just getting a steady 6 beats (K, K, R, L, R, L and K, K, R, R, L, L) and moving that around the kit making sure the muscle memorises and I feel comfortable, I'll be a heel toe demon in no time.
Oh yeah, and always in socks, I don't have a long footboard and I have size 11 (UK) feet so socks are a must to really feel the pedal and get the motion down.
Hmm, my foot always creeps and slides around on the pedal if I'm wearing socks. With bare feet, my foot grips at first then starts sweating, resulting in unwanted sliding. Shoes help me grip the footboard, and I can play faster and more easily wearing shoes, because I find it much more comfortable. :icon_eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by NoiseInMotion
There are a number of ways to do it, I found that I couldn't do other methods because I am flat-footed. However, I can do the one described by Derrick Pope. Even so, it doesn't really work for me....here's why:
1. Not enough power ... perhaps okay for Jazz drummers, but not enough for Rock.
2. I think I need a long-board pedal (like Axis) to be effective and get more power.
3. I found that I can cheat using the double-bass pedals :-)