My first master.. how'd I do?

[Russ]

Hey wanted to post this up to see what you guys thought. It's the first song I recorded and mixed. No backing song, just the track of me playing. Comments/suggestions on anything welcomed.
Click here to listen to harder better faster stronger - drum track.mp3

[Cant Get Enough]

How many mics? What kind of room or was it dry with plugin reverb? What kind of mics? Are you trying to prepare your drum sound to record other instruments at a later date? What genre of music will you be tracking?

[Russ]

14 mics- 6 toms, 2 snare, 2 bass, 2 big overheads(for the room), 2 small overheads.(for hi hats and ride) Originally I didn't wanna use so many but the second bass mic came with a bunch of others,(I have two kick drums) so I just went with it. Samson q series for drum mics, and mxl 990/991's for cymbals and room. 9x11 room, some effects added because of the size.(gate, reverb, then a little volume gain to final mix) Room is treated for sound, but I don't have any other instruments to track later- just thought i'd have some fun with it. The original recording was almost completely flat- no volume or frequency boosts, and then afterwards I edited with some effects to sweeten it.

[Russ]

Here's another one..
http://www.tindeck.com/listen/wgop

[funkyruss]

more kick, less hi hat, like turn off the hi hat mic! i would say get more attack on the toms, and the nice tone you have will follow- snare sounds good. the louder your signal at the time of recording, without distortion, clipping etc.. the better signal to noise ratio. don't boost after recording, get levels right while recording...................

So much fun eh!!!
Later Bro,
FR

[Cant Get Enough]

Can you post a pic of mic placement? Any dampening if so where? Tooooooo many mics!
Do you have any harware preferably gate/compresser for the kick and you're gonna need some pre EQing to get the toms and kick hotter.
The 991's should be used for overheads (total kit) in an xy or spaced pair but since you kit is rather large spaced pair is probably best. The 990's should be used sparingly and turned up last just loud enough to blur the kit together in fact when your turning it up and you start to notice a volume change then you've gone too loud

[Cant Get Enough]

Did you get the CO2 pencil mics with the kit?
Are you familiar with gain staging and and bringing up the mix. What's you're recording medium? Also do you know what levels to record each track at? -12 to -9 db's RMS for kick and snare, -12 db RMS toms, -15 db's for overheads. Remember the higher the db's the more presence it'll have. If you record to hot you'll loose headroom and transparency and if you record to high you'll most likely peak when summing requireing you to turn down the levels causing you to loose sonic detail. Ther's a fine line you should be at. Unless your recording to tape and that's a whole other ball game.

[late8]

For me, it's nearly impossible to tell where the board mix was due to the plug in compression and eq you're using in DAW post production of your mp3 clips. If at all possible, can you post your board mix before you dumped it into your PC so we can "see" where the master gain levels were?
Thanks!

[kaosotis]

Did you get the CO2 pencil mics with the kit?
Are you familiar with gain staging and and bringing up the mix. What's you're recording medium? Also do you know what levels to record each track at? -12 to -9 db's RMS for kick and snare, -12 db RMS toms, -15 db's for overheads. Remember the higher the db's the more presence it'll have. If you record to hot you'll loose headroom and transparency and if you record to high you'll most likely peak when summing requireing you to turn down the levels causing you to loose sonic detail. Ther's a fine line you should be at. Unless your recording to tape and that's a whole other ball game.

OK, now I know who to ask for recording help

[xsabers]

Hey wanted to post this up to see what you guys thought. It's the first song I recorded and mixed. No backing song, just the track of me playing. Comments/suggestions on anything welcomed.
Click here to listen to harder better faster stronger - drum track.mp3

Russ, I have to agree with late8. We will need more info about your raw recording before we can really comment on the final product. I was goofing around and did some raw recording with a single mic and then with a simple 4-mic set up. These were recorded to a single track digital tape so there was no chance to do any mixing or production. It sounds as it was played pretty much. Personally, I like the less produced sound of drums. Keep working it though. You have the gear and the desire. These efforts are all about learning and improving, right?

"Mic Test Audio" is one overhead mic. "MTA 2" is the 4-mic set up...just for grins...

http://www.tindeck.com/users/xsabers

[Russ]

I'll have to take a picture after my next session down there. I don't remember my EQ settings on the board, but I think for the most part everything was recorded flat(cymbal mics were dropped a tad, as well as the room). I didn't know what I was doing around then, and now I feel like I picked up a few techniques from my time reading threads. Mostly unmuffled, erings on toms and snare- I wasn't crazy about it but it was okay for a first try.

[Cant Get Enough]

Where do you want to start?

[Russ]

Where do you want to start?

I don't understand?

[late8]

I'll have to take a picture after my next session down there. I don't remember my EQ settings on the board, but I think for the most part everything was recorded flat(cymbal mics were dropped a tad, as well as the room). I didn't know what I was doing around then, and now I feel like I picked up a few techniques from my time reading threads. Mostly unmuffled, erings on toms and snare- I wasn't crazy about it but it was okay for a first try.

Russ, it is so critical to spend MORE time at the mixer while you are setting up the mics and adjusting levels at the board than to depend on plug EQ and compression in a DAW (Digital Work Station) to "fix" any issues surrounding your recordings. If at all possible try recording the raw audio, then listen to it at the recorder and make adjustments at the board, then do some minor tweeking in the DAW to help shape the sound you want. Set your peak levels -12db on the recorder and keep them there so you have a consistant record threshold or benchmark, then you can adjust accordingly in the DAW to keep levels consistant.

[Russ]

The mic positioning:
toms/snare- about 1-2 inches from head, pointed between edge and center
bass- 2 inches inside reso, pointed at beater
hats/ride- 3 inches away, pointed at bell
overheads- diaphragm pointing straight down at the crash cymbals, in a horizontal line, located 4 feet above the left and right side of the kit

[late8]

The mic positioning:
toms/snare- about 1-2 inches from head, pointed between edge and center
bass- 2 inches inside reso, pointed at beater
hats/ride- 3 inches away, pointed at bell
overheads- diaphragm pointing straight down at the crash cymbals, in a horizontal line, located 4 feet above the left and right side of the kit

That sounds like good mic placement Russ. What you need now is to "work" those mics at the board to start "shaping" the different componets you described you've mic'd.

[Cant Get Enough]

The mic positioning:
toms/snare- about 1-2 inches from head, pointed between edge and center
bass- 2 inches inside reso, pointed at beater
hats/ride- 3 inches away, pointed at bell
overheads- diaphragm pointing straight down at the crash cymbals, in a horizontal line, located 4 feet above the left and right side of the kit

If you need more presence (attack) aim the tom mic to the center about 1 inch inside the rim 2 inches above the head. Point away from center for more tone.
Over heads should be about 1.5 to 2 feet above cymbals. Since you have spaced (the wider the bigger the stereo field, to wide and it'll sound unnatural) them I'd aim slightly towards you snare. With your hats listen to them with your ear close to them (don't break your eardrum) and move farther away until you like the sound, thats how your mic will "hear it". 6 to 8 inches will give you isolation but a more natural sound than being too close. I record with miked hats but usually leave them out of the mix. I would only mic the ride if I wanted to place it in a specific place in the stereo field or to dominate the mix in certain parts. I use O rings for my tom and a little moon gel for snare, just enough to control overtones. As for your kick, If your too close to the hole you'll get a concentration of air exiting creating a airy cloudy sound I use to do this too but then was taught to get inside far enough to avoid this problem. 6 to 8 inches from the batter head will produce better results and start by aiming towards the rim a move towards the beater until you get the attack you desire. (try to match the amount of attack as your toms to acheive a balance between the rest of your kit, fine tune during mixdown with EQ) To achieve a controled thump I'd muffle the kick I personally use a Evan gate and Evens EQ pad (bounces off the head) because they are thin and allow the air to travel between the heads, a bulky blanket or pillow will block airflow.

P.S. record everthing center except pan the overheads hard L and R and during mixdown, pan the toms in the stereo field in the same location as in the overheads.

[Cant Get Enough]

I don't understand?

Maybe I should of used A smiley face and a quote. I was talkin to the other guy.
I feel like a peice of crap now, thanks alot.

[Russ]

If you need more presence (attack) aim the tom mic to the center about 1 inch inside the rim 2 inches above the head. Point away from center for more tone.
Over heads should be about 1.5 to 2 feet above cymbals. Since you have spaced (the wider the bigger the stereo field, to wide and it'll sound unnatural) them I'd aim slightly towards you snare. With your hats listen to them with your ear close to them (don't break your eardrum) and move farther away until you like the sound, thats how your mic will "hear it". 6 to 8 inches will give you isolation but a more natural sound than being too close. I record with miked hats but usually leave them out of the mix. I would only mic the ride if I wanted to place it in a specific place in the stereo field or to dominate the mix in certain parts. I use O rings for my tom and a little moon gel for snare, just enough to control overtones. As for your kick, If your too close to the hole you'll get a concentration of air exiting creating a airy cloudy sound I use to do this too but then was taught to get inside far enough to avoid this problem. 6 to 8 inches from the batter head will produce better results and start by aiming towards the rim a move towards the beater until you get the attack you desire. (try to match the amount of attack as your toms to acheive a balance between the rest of your kit, fine tune during mixdown with EQ) To achieve a controled thump I'd muffle the kick I personally use a Evan gate and Evens EQ pad (bounces off the head) because they are thin and allow the air to travel between the heads, a bulky blanket or pillow will block airflow.

P.S. record everthing center except pan the overheads hard L and R and during mixdown, pan the toms in the stereo field in the same location as in the overheads.

Man this is some seriously excellent advice, thank you very much. I was considering the idea of hard panning but wanted to be a little more sure of it before trying. Also, would it be good to hard l and r pan anything that is double mic'd such as bass or snare?

Maybe I should of used A smiley face and a quote. I was talkin to the other guy.
I feel like a peice of crap now, thanks alot.

I don't think you are, and no one else probably does either. I was just a little confused at first is all.

[Cant Get Enough]

Keep it centered on the snare and the kick while tracking If your micing the snare underneath just reverse phase any other position keep it centered. Now if your stereo micing the snare you could pan slightly to widen the snare during mixdown gives you a big sound. With double bass It'll most always be centered with one exception some engineers will pan 10 and 2 during doble bass "rolls" but be carefull cause all that bass which is omnidirectional needs the center to really hit especially with mono subs. Some engineers will actually pan the floor tom during mixdown center because of low frequency reproduction.