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Thread: Bass drum syncopation

  1. #1

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    Default Bass drum syncopation

    Hey guys, Can anyone help me out with these? Its because when I try a bass drum syncopation my hi hat or my ride hand moves quickly to play along with my syncopation. Is there any way to keep my hand to keep my hand playing one speed only. Thank you

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rainard View Post
    Hey guys, Can anyone help me out with these? Its because when I try a bass drum syncopation my hi hat or my ride hand moves quickly to play along with my syncopation. Is there any way to keep my hand to keep my hand playing one speed only. Thank you
    doing any type of syncopation is hard at first...the only thing you can do is practice slow and work it up from there.

  3. #3

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    Play over and over and over and over and over.

    Practice with your hands and feet when you're in the car, at your desk, in the bus.

    Play over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

    You'll get it.
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  4. #4

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    As has been said above, practice/practice/practice and more practice. Start slowly and increase speed as you get comfortable with the exercise and can do it with no mistakes. Invest the time. It's the only way.

  5. #5

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    One exercise you definitely need to have so you can achieve a consistent 'right hand on eighth notes' is to practice playing slow eighth notes with your right hand so that you can evenly place offbeat 16th's with your right foot.

    So if your right hand does: 1 (e) + (a), 2 (e) + (a) (count on the rests in brackets)

    your right foot does the: (1) e (+) a, (2) e (+) a, etc.

    By doing this, you'll be able to 'split' sixteenths betwen two surfaces. If you do find this hard, you can do an easier version, what I call the 'quarters & eighth note' version.

    Ie: Right hand doing: 1 (+) 2 (+) 3 (+) 4 (+)
    whilst with right foot: (1) + (2) + (3) + (4) +

    Do these slowly, don't rush them. Speed will come with accuracy, not the other way around. That way, when say a right foot goes together with an eighth note hi-hat on '1', whilst an offbeat 1/16th kick goes after the next right hand hi-hat hit on the '+', you will have hopefully practiced that sort of control that you wanted to achieve with your right hand.
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  6. #6

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    I also had trouble with this when I first played. My teacher told my to play it really slow, and count out loud. This really helped me out.

  7. #7

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    All I can do is echo what everyone else said - take it slow and do it over and over and over. Some people refer to this as limb independence, and some tend to think of it as interdependence. I prefer the latter term because to me, it just seems that it's less about being independent and more about knowing the relationship and interaction between the limbs. Then again, I'm not what you'd call an over technical drummer, so that has to be taken with a big grain of salt.
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  8. #8

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    Independence of right hand from right foot, i have been battling that one. I just cannot get that. This tune, very simple, drives me nuts, as right hand follows 1/4 notes on hats and bass drum does 1/4 notes then a few extra beats every so often.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iR2V60yLIaw"]Free - All Right Now (Studio Version) - YouTube[/ame]

  9. #9

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    Default Re: Bass drum syncopation

    Quote Originally Posted by dropdtune View Post
    Independence of right hand from right foot, i have been battling that one. I just cannot get that. This tune, very simple, drives me nuts, as right hand follows 1/4 notes on hats and bass drum does 1/4 notes then a few extra beats every so often.

    Free - All Right Now (Studio Version) - YouTube
    This is very interesting. I'm sure you are a very good drummer and don't be offended, but, this is about as simple as a song can get. Maybe you're hearing more than what is actually there.

    Here, take a look at this. Maybe it will help you:

    All Right Now-Free

    Intro
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|

    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-o---o---o-----|

    Verse 1
    |-------x2-------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-------|o-o-----o-o-----|

    |-------x2-------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o---o---o-----|o-------o-o-----|

    |---------------x2----------------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|

    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---------------|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|----------------|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----oooooooooooo|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o---o---o-----|o-------o-o-----|o---o---o---o---|

    Chorus:
    Cr|x---------------|------------x---|----------------|------------x---|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|----x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|--o-----o---o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-----o---o-----|

    Cr|x---------------|------------x---|----------------|----------------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|----x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|

    Cr|x---------------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|----x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-o---o---o-----|

    Bridge:
    |---------------x2----------------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|

    Verse:
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o---o---o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|

    |-------x8-------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|

    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---------------|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|----------------|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----oooooooooooo|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o---o---o-----|o-------o-o-----|o---o---o---o---|

    Chorus:
    Cr|x---------------|------------x---|----------------|------------x---|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|--o-----o---o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-----o---o-----|

    Cr|x---------------|----------------|----------------|----------------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
    Cb|----x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----------------|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|----------------|

    Guitar solo
    |-------x8-------|---------------x3----------------|
    Cr|----------------|----------------|------------x---|----------------|
    Hh|----------------|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x-------|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|------------f---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|----------------|o-o-----o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|

    |---------------x2----------------|
    Cr|------------x---|x---------------|------------x---|x---------------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x-------|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|----x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|o---o-------o---|
    Bs|o-o-----o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|

    |-------x12------|
    Cr|------------x---|x---------------|----------------|----------------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|----------------|----------------|
    Cb|----x---x-------|----x---x---x---|----------------|----------------|
    Sn|----o-------o---|o---o---o---o---|----oooooooooooo|ooooooooooooo-o-|
    Bs|o-o-----o-o-----|o-------o-o---o-|o---------------|----------------|

    Cr|x---------------|----------------|
    Cb|----x---x---x---|----------------|
    Hi|----------------|---oo-----------|
    Md|----------------|-------o--------|
    Fl|----------------|--------o-o-----|
    Sn|---------------o|o-----------f---|
    Bs|----------------|o---o---o-o-----|

    Chorus:
    Cr|x---------------|------------x---|----------------|------------x---|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x-------|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|--o-----o---o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-----o---o-----|

    Cr|x---------------|----------------|----------------|----------------|
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|----------------|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|----------------|
    Hi|----------------|----------------|----------------|------f---------|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o-oo|f-----------f---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-o-----o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|--o-o---o-o-----|

    Repeat to fade.
    Last edited by inthpktplayer; 01-31-2012 at 02:07 PM.

  10. #10

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    Default Re: Bass drum syncopation

    Inpckt - thanks for the write-up, and no offence taken, I don't know you anyway.

    ya its is a deadly simple 4 except the 3rd "p" in the Hh line doesn't match exactly what the 3rd "o" in the Bs is doing. For me, (yes I guess not a very good drummer), it requires the right hand to not play the 3+ on the Bs note. The right hand independence just on that one bit.

    Intro
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by dropdtune View Post
    Inpckt - thanks for the write-up, and no offence taken, I don't know you anyway.

    ya its is a deadly simple 4 except the 3rd "p" in the Hh line doesn't match exactly what the 3rd "o" in the Bs is doing. For me, (yes I guess not a very good drummer), it requires the right hand to not play the 3+ on the Bs note. The right hand independence just on that one bit.

    Intro
    Hh|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|p---p---p---p---|
    Cb|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|x---x---x---x---|
    Sn|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|----o-------o---|
    Bs|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|o-------o-o-----|
    Yep, its a basic rock beat. Snare on the 2 & the 4, kick on the 1 & 3 an. Try practicing it while doing 1/8 notes on the HH. Do it very slowly and then speed it up to where you can get to about 90 bpm. Over and over again. Then start again slowly, then try switching to 1/4 notes on the HH. Do this very slowly until you get comfortable. Then try speeding it up. If you mess up, slow down again. Keep doing this until you can get it up to about 90 bpm.

    Or just try this exercise:

    Hh lx---x---x---x---lx---x---x---x---lx---x---x---x---l
    Bs lo--oo---o--oo--lo--oo---o--oo--lo--oo---o--oo--l

    So you're playing 1/4 notes on the HH: 1 2 3 4 and then
    a combination 1/4 notes and 1/8 notes on the kick: 1 an 2 3 an4

    Hope this helps.

  12. #12

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    thanks will do. Simon Kirke has some great solid playing, very simple (for him) but then throws in a few odd things too (some of the cymbal crashes are offbeat too). And sorry to hijack a thread.

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by dropdtune View Post
    thanks will do. Simon Kirke has some great solid playing, very simple (for him) but then throws in a few odd things too (some of the cymbal crashes are offbeat too). And sorry to hijack a thread.
    dropdtune, I play this song in my current band and I know what "odd" things you are describing. He's just hitting the snare on the (+) instead of 2 or 4 on the parts your talking about. You can figure this out and do it with practice. Take and listen the measure(s) that have these parts in them over and over again. Don't listen past these parts of the song. Listen to them closely and count out the beats until you have it in your head what he is doing. Then, take it to the kit slowly. With a little patience, you'll be rockin'.

    As far as the cymbal parts, he's doing the same thing. Sometimes he's just hitting the hats half open on the down beat and other times he's hitting the crash. I would work out the snare parts first, then incorporate the cymbal/hat accents/crashes later.

    I don't know if you have seen this video or not, but it's a live version thay may help you hear and see what exactly he's playing.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ny7vW6dgnUY"]Free - All Right Now [totp] - YouTube[/ame]
    "it is what it is"

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  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rainard View Post
    Hey guys, Can anyone help me out with these? Its because when I try a bass drum syncopation my hi hat or my ride hand moves quickly to play along with my syncopation. Is there any way to keep my hand to keep my hand playing one speed only. Thank you
    Rainard, my appologies for not addressing your thread. There's not much more I can tell you then what everyone else has already said. Patience and practice will go a long way when learning drums. If it were easy, everyone would be playing. Take it slow and keep it simple.
    "it is what it is"

    "Dont rent anything you cant afford to burn in the backyard while drunk." - ThePloughman

  15. #15

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    +1 to what DrummerD said. Listen to the parts you are having trouble with. Songs don't get too much easier than this. Get this down and you can move on to other things.

  16. #16

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    yep, its about time taken to practice, and slowly. but am a busy guy, and time is my enemy right now. need to give up the rat race.

  17. #17

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    DrummerD, thanks for that vid, always helpful to 'see it'.

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by dropdtune View Post
    need to give up the rat race.
    Yeah, don't we all.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by dropdtune View Post
    and time is my enemy right now. need to give up the rat race.
    aint that the truth.

  20. #20

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    what helped me was to think 16th notes in your head, while the HiHat plays 8th notes, so on the 'e' and 'a' try to imagine hitting another drum on the upswing where you're not actually playing anything.

    I am faced with the same issue trying to gain left foot independence, but splitting the root pattern in half makes it easier.. at least for me

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