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Thread: Cracks in lacquer

  1. #1

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    Default Cracks in lacquer

    Hi all, this is my first post on here but I have seen some similar threads regarding this issue...

    So unloaded the van last night to play a show and whilst setting up I noticed some hairline cracking in my bass drum (I play a Yamaha Maple Custom Absolute in Black Sparkle Sunburst finish). There is one that runs about 45cm around the drum and a couple of smaller ones as well.

    Obviously I was very disappointed and spent some time trying to work out what has caused it. the drum has not been dropped or anything. It has however spent plenty of nights in the van when we are out on tour which, I admit, is fair from ideal particularly if the weather is very cold or very hot.

    I have seen pics of similar cracking on other lacquer kits on a number of different forums etc but can't find much info. I have spoken to a yamaha rep and he didn't really sound like he wanted to know to be honest.

    The shell itself seems totally fine I took one of the heads off and had a close look using a torch and good feel all round the inside of the shell which has made me 99.9% happy it is purely damage to the lacquer.

    I suppose my questions are;

    1) Why do you think this would have happened? Is it likely the difference in temperature over the 2 years I have had the kit have caused it when the shell has expanded/ contracted but the lacquer hasn't been able to flex? If so now it has cracked a bit do we think that will be the end of it as the extra 'room' will cause the problem?

    2) If it isn't damage to the shell (which I am pretty confident there is not but I will be closely monitoring) should I be particularly worried? Obviously I am disappointed the looks have been spoilt somewhat but I am more interested in making sure they carry on SOUNDING awesome. Do we think it will continue to spread? Will more cracks appear?

    Any advice/ information would be very much appreciated.

  2. #2

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    i wouldnt worry too much if its only the finish that has cracked. it shouldnt effect the sound of the drum . when the drums are in the van ,are they in cases ?
    Tamaholic

  3. #3

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    They are fully cased in Hardcase and also have towels draped over/ round them.

    Like I said having done a bit of research on this I am think it has probably been caused by humidity/ temperature changes. The other week we had a bit of snow in London and the kit had been in the van for 2 nights. When we showed up to the show the next day I guess this would have been a quick change of temperature for it and this might have cause expansion to the wood.

    Then at the next gig I noticed it. As long as it doesn't get worse I will just live with it. Touring is what I have to do and drums are made to be played so there is only so much I can do I guess.

  4. #4

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    Yamaha should have warrantees against defects etc. I have never dealt with Yamaha but have heard bad customer service from others. I have Pearls and they come with a lifetime warranty ,I mean lifetime for anything from cracking, peeling etc on all their drums and harware. I hope eveything turn out good for you but I would still push Yamaha over this. good luck.

  5. #5

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    Quote Originally Posted by Pearl MCX Man View Post
    Yamaha should have warrantees against defects etc. I have never dealt with Yamaha but have heard bad customer service from others. I have Pearls and they come with a lifetime warranty ,I mean lifetime for anything from cracking, peeling etc on all their drums and harware. I hope eveything turn out good for you but I would still push Yamaha over this. good luck.
    I have had a look at the warranty situation and if you review the small print in a lot of them there seems to be a catch all where they say equipment must be kept in controlled environment avoiding extreme weather (I guess the back of a van in winter invalidates that). The thing is they know what us musicians have to do and 50% of the gear that leaves their warehouses must be trated the same as mine. I don't like it but there is little alternative.

    By the way here is the PEARL warrenty from their website... finishes are not covered for a lifetime. Only the shells!


    LIFETIME WARRANTY

    ▪ Drum Set/Concert wood and metal shells for the Lifetime of the Original Owner.
    ▪ Foot pedals, hi-hat stands, cymbals stands, boom cymbal stands, snare drum stands, floor-standing tom stands, floor- standing cymbal/tom stands, concert stands, racks and rack accessories, cymbal holders and multi-clamps for the Lifetime of the Original Owner. Some exceptions apply.
    ▪ Drum Set claws, tension rods, swivel nuts, spurs, tom brackets, tom holders, strainers, and nuts and bolts for the Lifetime of the Original Owner.
    ▪ Rotationally molded cases for the Lifetime of the Original Owner.
    ▪ The LIFETIME WARRANTY applies to the aforementioned Pearl products purchased from June 15, 2009.



    3 YEARS

    ▪ Marching Wood Shells.



    2 YEARS

    ▪ All Pearl Percussion products (except rims lugs, and tuning plates which have a 1 year warranty).



    1 year

    ▪ SoundCheck drums, stands, pedals, hardware, and parts.
    ▪ Covered and lacquered finishes on all Pearl drums.
    ▪ RH-2000 Remote Hat cable.
    ▪ Collar Joint on all Pearl drum thrones.
    ▪ Gas Cylinder on the D-3000TC throne.
    ▪ Marching claws, tension rods, swivel nuts, strainers, and nuts and bolts.
    ▪ Marching carriers and marching carrier parts.
    ▪ Tru-Trac electronic drum pads and rubber pad surfaces.
    ▪ R.E.D. BOX electronic drum module, cables, and junction boxes.
    ▪ THRONE THUMPER and THRONE THUMPER amplifier.
    ▪ PRECISION DRUM MONITOR headphones.
    ▪ Snare Kits, Bell Kits, Percussion Learning Centers and their corresponding bags and cases.
    ▪ All ADAMS products.
    ▪ Taiko heads.


    THIS WARRANTY DOESN'T COVER:
    ▪ Normal wear and tear.
    ▪ Improper assembly.
    ▪ Improper follow-up maintenance or repair.
    ▪ Installation of non-genuine Pearl parts or components.
    ▪ Instruments that have been sold as "B-Stock", sold as second-hand, or resold contrary to US export regulations.
    ▪ Instruments that have been altered, modified or have been damaged through misuse, negligence, improper operation or accidents.
    ▪ Instruments subjected to abnormal strain, neglect, abuse, modification or exposure to extreme variances in temperature or humidity.
    ▪ Instruments whose trademark, name or identification number has been changed or removed.
    ▪ Drum hardware and stands plated in Black Chrome, Gold, Satin Chrome, and Black Nickel.
    ▪ Drum hardware and stands finished in Black or White Electro-coat.
    ▪ Consumables such as but not limited to: heads sticks, brushes, beaters, springs, straps, slings, wire snares, cable snares, gut snares, cords/straps, cymbals, bass drum hoop protectors, wheels and casters.
    ▪ The playing surface on Pearl Percussion cajons.
    ▪ The heads on the Pearl Percussion Fun Drum.

  6. #6

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    I had the same thing happen with my Ddrum AMX a couple years ago. Practice in my heated garage, was too lazy to bring it back in my house. Went out there the next morning after a cold MN winter night with the heater off, and everything but my floor tom had hairline cracks in the finish.

  7. #7

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    Quote Originally Posted by T-Bone29 View Post
    I had the same thing happen with my Ddrum AMX a couple years ago. Practice in my heated garage, was too lazy to bring it back in my house. Went out there the next morning after a cold MN winter night with the heater off, and everything but my floor tom had hairline cracks in the finish.
    Interesting... What happend after that though?

    Did the cracks continue to spread each time you played or was that the end of it?

    Did you stop leaving them out there etc?

    I can live with it if it is only cosmetic but I am keen to find out if it's going to a) progress from playing or b) progress from more nights in the van.

    My thinking is the fact it has cracked now might mean when the drum expands next time if might already have enough room to move!!

    Thanks for your responses so far.

    (I did also post a response to Pearl MCX Man about the Pearl Warrenty but the mods don't seem to have approved it... yet)

  8. #8
    doctor dirt Guest

    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    Their not made to handle temperatures that drop below 40d after being played in normal temps then put in cases then spend days in a cargo van. These lacquers finishes aren't applied very thick, they're simular to a thin wrap material. Its no big deal really their your tools and cosmetics get less an less important when your a full time musician. The only thing you can do to protect them is to wipe them down if theres humidity on the finish prior to casing them. You can also use bags instead of cases and buy the shipping blankets and cover the bags. This will allow them to dry and have some air around them and the heavier blankets can help with extreme cold. Personally a few cracks in the finishe add character hahaha its ALL about the sound and after another few years its time for a new set anyways. Drum sets are write offs and you should be working towards a sponsorship and endorsement too.
    Tools need to be in great working order but drums have never been that important to me. My hardware and cymbals are much more of a concern to me and I hope your NOT leaving your cymbals in the trailer, they need to be OUT of extreme cold. Keep them with you!! Doc

  9. #9

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    Quote Originally Posted by UK Drummer View Post
    They are fully cased in Hardcase and also have towels draped over/ round them.

    Like I said having done a bit of research on this I am think it has probably been caused by humidity/ temperature changes. The other week we had a bit of snow in London and the kit had been in the van for 2 nights. When we showed up to the show the next day I guess this would have been a quick change of temperature for it and this might have cause expansion to the wood.

    Then at the next gig I noticed it. As long as it doesn't get worse I will just live with it. Touring is what I have to do and drums are made to be played so there is only so much I can do I guess.
    That would be my guess, a rapid temp/humidity change. I've brought my kit from a hot car into the house when the a/c was on and everything was covered in condensation in seconds. I was a little concerned about the lacquer finish then. I'm sure it would be the same going from cold van to a warm club, but the cold may have made the finish a little stiffer and brittle, causing the cracks.

    **The cracks usually happen from the inside out where the finish and wood make contact (if you run your fingers over the cracks, can you feel them, or is it smooth?) the wood and finish expand and contract at different rates; generally not a problem if it happens gradually. That's what I got from our guitar player, who is also a custom furniture maker and finisher.**

  10. #10

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    Quote Originally Posted by Linchpin View Post
    That would be my guess, a rapid temp/humidity change. I've brought my kit from a hot car into the house when the a/c was on and everything was covered in condensation in seconds. I was a little concerned about the lacquer finish then. I'm sure it would be the same going from cold van to a warm club, but the cold may have made the finish a little stiffer and brittle, causing the cracks.

    **The cracks usually happen from the inside out where the finish and wood make contact (if you run your fingers over the cracks, can you feel them, or is it smooth?) the wood and finish expand and contract at different rates; generally not a problem if it happens gradually. That's what I got from our guitar player, who is also a custom furniture maker and finisher.**
    I can feel the crack but it is very fine. almost like a scratch however I know it is not as it goes under a tension rod a one point so can't be.

    Sounds like your guitar player would be a good persons brain to pick about this! Do we think there will be any issues going forward as a result of this or is that the end of it? (Short of ANOTHER instance of the same thing happening again I mean)!

    Doctor- my cymbals always come out of the van with me over night and into a house/ hotel etc. Despite anything else the worth in total is about £1200 and I always feel they are very easily carried off if someone broke in so seems to make sense to take them with me!

    Thanks again for your help so far everyone.

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by UK Drummer View Post
    Interesting... What happend after that though?

    Did the cracks continue to spread each time you played or was that the end of it?

    Did you stop leaving them out there etc?

    I can live with it if it is only cosmetic but I am keen to find out if it's going to a) progress from playing or b) progress from more nights in the van.

    My thinking is the fact it has cracked now might mean when the drum expands next time if might already have enough room to move!!

    Thanks for your responses so far.

    (I did also post a response to Pearl MCX Man about the Pearl Warrenty but the mods don't seem to have approved it... yet)
    There were multiple cracks so I didn't really pay attention to it. I never noticed it going through the shell at all either. They didn't seem to expand any further either. I don't even notice them much anymore too.
    I bring them inside every night now if I practice out there. Also if I have to bring them somewhere during the winter, I make sure all of the drums are put inside my car and everything else can go in the trunk.

  12. #12

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    Breezing through the previous posts...if this has been said before...sorry.

    But, the cracks are due to adverse weather conditions. This has been a bane to guitarists for forever. Guitars are notorious for that same cracking condition with a lacquer finish.

    It's due to the expansion and contraction of the wood either by temp or humidity.

    Since it isn't a defect from the MFG., they aren't going to cover it.

    Now in comparison I had a lacquer finished Mapex Saturn kit. Unless you look at the lighting just right you couldn't see the crack but mine was starting to spider out from a center location that happened to be right behind where a brad (nail) was used to attach the badging to the drum.

    Mapex agreed it was a defect more than any form of abuse. They would have replaced it under warranty if I'd have sent it in. However, I sold the kit before that so I never got to use warranty replacement.

    For the very reason you are having this kind of trouble, I tend to use a kit with a wrap instead of the awesome lacquer finishes just to avoid that cracking potential.

    Sorry for your damage but I think you are stuck with it.
    Signature here

  13. #13

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    Default Re: Cracks in lacquer

    UK Drummer the reason the mods did not like your post is because you are not allowed to cut and paste info from other websites and bring them here. Anything before July 15 2009 is normal warranty and that date it is lifetime warranty of what I read. I will give you an example in Aug 2209 I bought a new MCX snare and about a year later I notice when I took off the top batter head that the plies where coming apart on the shell near the near the seam ( just a slight hair line) so I notified Pearl and they came good for it they replaced the snare for a new one. I had to show them some pics of the hairline crack and their response was that I qualified under the Pearl Lifetime warranty. So I am not sure under what catagory that fell in. Maybe the weather, heat, cold or humidity may have cause this none the less they replaced it at their cost shipping etc. This is just an example of my experience with their warranty

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pearl MCX Man View Post
    UK Drummer the reason the mods did not like your post is because you are not allowed to cut and paste info from other websites and bring them here. Anything before July 15 2009 is normal warranty and that date it is lifetime warranty of what I read. I will give you an example in Aug 2209 I bought a new MCX snare and about a year later I notice when I took off the top batter head that the plies where coming apart on the shell near the near the seam ( just a slight hair line) so I notified Pearl and they came good for it they replaced the snare for a new one. I had to show them some pics of the hairline crack and their response was that I qualified under the Pearl Lifetime warranty. So I am not sure under what catagory that fell in. Maybe the weather, heat, cold or humidity may have cause this none the less they replaced it at their cost shipping etc. This is just an example of my experience with their warranty
    Yeah, although the mods have let it through now which is cool.

    Surely your example falls under the lifetime warrenty because it is damage to the shell though. The warrenty info that I pasted above says that "Covered and lacquered finishes on all Pearl drums" is only one year. Thats how I read it anyway.

    And bish- I am aware I am stuck with it and I unfortunatly I just have to live with it. I guess my main concern is if this crack will lead on to other issues or if it is a one off due to a specific instance of humidity/ cold---> hot change.

    You have all been very helpful I must say!

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