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Thread: Mordern music

  1. #1

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    Default Mordern music

    I know back in the day, when Led Zeppelin and all those very talent bands were in the spot light all the musicians took what they did very seriously and practiced hard. Do you think musicians today praticed as much as the old timers did? seems like music today is so unoriginal, nothing like the old bands.

  2. #2
    Shazane Guest

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    Good bands today are just as talented and practiced as much as the ones back then, I guess you aren't hearing the right stuff... the crap everyone talks about is awful, its the underground stuff that's good, that's kind of how it's always been, there were plenty of horrible unoriginal bands last generation too.

  3. #3

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    Cool Mordern music

    Memory is a funny thing...it can be selective...

    The best bands almost always had the discipline to practice--then and now...the music styles may have changed, but there were always awesome bands and awful bands...
    keep the beat goin' ... Don't keep it to yourself!

    Charlie

    "If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away." --Henry David Thoreau, "Walden," 1854

    "There's a lot to be said for Time Honored tradition and value." --In memory of Frank "fiacovaz" Iacovazzi

    "Maybe your drums can be beat, but you can't."--Jack Keck

  4. #4

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    I think of it like this - if you compare old to new - the new will never sound original. There was always someone before who did it already, maybe not exactly the same, but something like it. Maybe not as heavy, or as fast, or with that articular rhythm pattern but it was done.

    Before the guys like Led Zepplin and Ozzy and Deep Purple and Ac/DC there were tehrs - including the Beatles and Elvis (beleive it or not they inspired some of the heaviest rock bands from the 70's with their earlier stuff) Before them were other guys and beofre them were other people.

    It's pointless to compare, because music will always influence someone to copy a style or sound, it will always bring about new thigns (in the sense of HOW more so thatn WHAT) and the people who dedicate themselves to it will always be successful in some degree - not always financially, but if they really truley don't care about that part - then it won't matter.

    I also don't like the idea that people who are mainstream or poppy or whatever are treated like they are a subclass of musician. Christina Aguilera (as an example) has to work just as hard at what she does as anyone else out there. People like here may not write their own music, but as far as their career goes - it wouldn't be easy being them, and it doesn't detract fomr their ability to be musical. Not every musician is also a songwriter - in fact most musicians in my opinion should just not bother. Same as not every song writer is a muso -and then some people who can play or sing should bother trying to be either and just play their bit that someone else wrote, it works out better for everyone that way.

    I personally don't care how "manufactured" something is, as long I beleive that the band or person singing/playing fits that song. When a song is manufactured and the person is forced to fit that style or whatever then it doesn't sound right. When they try to hard to make it like something else that the singer/band actualyl isn't, just to try and be popular, then I don't like it.

    I got off topic.....Yes, people practise nowadays just as much as the guys back then.
    "What consumes your mind, controls your life" - So, what consumes your mind?

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lafirin View Post
    Do you think musicians today praticed as much as the old timers did?
    Yes.

  6. #6
    Shazane Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by crazymanwithaplunger View Post

    I also don't like the idea that people who are mainstream or poppy or whatever are treated like they are a subclass of musician. Christina Aguilera (as an example) has to work just as hard at what she does as anyone else out there. People like here may not write their own music, but as far as their career goes - it wouldn't be easy being them, and it doesn't detract fomr their ability to be musical. Not every musician is also a songwriter - in fact most musicians in my opinion should just not bother. Same as not every song writer is a muso -and then some people who can play or sing should bother trying to be either and just play their bit that someone else wrote, it works out better for everyone that way.

    I personally don't care how "manufactured" something is, as long I beleive that the band or person singing/playing fits that song. When a song is manufactured and the person is forced to fit that style or whatever then it doesn't sound right. When they try to hard to make it like something else that the singer/band actualyl isn't, just to try and be popular, then I don't like it.

    I got off topic.....Yes, people practise nowadays just as much as the guys back then.
    I can't agree with this... Christina Aguilera has absolutely no talent and doesn't deserve any of the recognition she got. The fact is that she and every clone of her was entirely manufactured by record labels to profit off the idiotic masses, there is nothing musical about it, it's corruption and extortion disguised as a song, and furthermore it is her image that sells and not her music at all and she has helped corrupt our youth into thinking they should all be mindless sluts.

    Doesn't have to be the singer but bands should ALWAYS write their own songs with the exception of covers. Some people have no poetic talent but they should still write their own lyrics, just look at Arch Enemy, their lyrics are awful, but they wouldn't be Arch Enemy if Dani Filth wrote all their lyrics. Or for an example you probably know better, Nirvana; their lyrics were terrible and there was nothing special about their music but honestly the simplicity of it made them who they were because you knew that they wrote it and it was unique to them.

    If you play someone else's song because you can't write one as good then you are just lazy, because whatever you manage to write will be good in some way because it will truly be your style. The only reason to play someone else's song is out of reverence.

    If most musicians, as you suggest, did not write their own songs, then there would be nothing unique about them, everything would be mainstream, music would be dead!

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shazane View Post
    I can't agree with this... Christina Aguilera has absolutely no talent and doesn't deserve any of the recognition she got. The fact is that she and every clone of her was entirely manufactured by record labels to profit off the idiotic masses, there is nothing musical about it, it's corruption and extortion disguised as a song, and furthermore it is her image that sells and not her music at all and she has helped corrupt our youth into thinking they should all be mindless sluts.
    Has it occurred to you that some people might like Christina Aguilera? I dont, im just asking. Its unfair of you to call someone mindless jst beacuse the like a certain typer of music.

    Who cares how "mainstream" something is? The music is all that matters.

  8. #8

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    Check out Nightwish.They have talent and attitude.
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    RIP Frank - You will be remembered

  9. #9
    Shazane Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by vinnysimmo View Post
    Has it occurred to you that some people might like Christina Aguilera? I dont, im just asking. Its unfair of you to call someone mindless jst beacuse the like a certain typer of music.

    Who cares how "mainstream" something is? The music is all that matters.
    I'm not saying anything about her type of music, just about her. There are talented people in that genre (not in America, but still...) I call her mindless because she doesn't write her own songs or come up with any ideas about who she is, the label created her, she has shown absolutely no innovation or independent thought at all.

    I care how mainstream it is BECAUSE the music is all that matters, mainstream bands often dont care about the music, they're in it for the money or fame instead, consequentially alot of mainstream music is generic, unoriginal and uninspired.

    Good music comes from bands who care about the music and the fans above all else, these bands aren't mainstream because they aren't extremely famous and have no desire to be.

  10. #10

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    ^ You should check out Nightwish they are considered mainstream in Europe and mainly Finland
    Paiste Posse
    14inch 2002 series Sound Edge Hi-hats
    16inch and 18inch Signature series Fast crashes
    20inch 3000 series Ride
    18inch PST5 series China

    Pearl Forum Series drum set
    Pearl Chad Smith Signature snare(steel shell)
    Tama Iron Cobra Chrome

    RIP Frank - You will be remembered

  11. #11
    Shazane Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Andreeew View Post
    ^ You should check out Nightwish they are considered mainstream in Europe and mainly Finland
    Yeah, I like Nightwish. Mainstream is different in Scandinavia because there is so much good metal there and else where in Europe.

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    Did I just read someone comparing the skill of Deep Purple and the mighty Led Zeppelin to todays bands? Somebody put a bullet in my head!

  13. #13
    Shazane Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roaddebris View Post
    Did I just read someone comparing the skill of Deep Purple and the mighty Led Zeppelin to todays bands? Somebody put a bullet in my head!
    There are bands as talented or more talented than Deep Purple and Led Zeppelin today, yes. Take Children of Bodom.

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    Shazane you need to figure this out for yourself obviously. First she does actually write some of her own songs, second, veyr few poeple are able to sing asw ell as her, so she is very talented. Add ot that ehr recording and touring schedule, etc.. etc... and I can gaurantee you she works just as hard as anyone else in the music business. Eveyrone involved in music deserves their dues. I may not like a particular style, however I try and refrain from slandering them for it.

    To be honest I DO think your main contention is her style, and others like her. Your last comment saying that Children of Bodom is better than Led Zepplin and Deep Purple gives me eveidence of that. Just because someoething isn't what you like doens't make the people crap, or mindless or whatever. Just because people don't agree with you doesn't make them mindelss. Personally, I actually like Christina Aguilera. I hvae ecletic tatses in music. I also like 50 Cent. I also like Limp Bizkit. I also like Boston. I also like Tracey Byrd. Am I mindless - no. Do I care about people writing their own lyrics - no. Do I like the song becuase there's something about it I like - yes. It's that simple. I really don't understand why it matters who writes a song, how popular and manufactured for the masses it is - as long as the perosn performing the song is true to themselves - the song they are perofrming is them, not someone else. Kinda like imagine Metallica trying to be like all the modern metal bands (kinda like they already do) - it doens't work. But when they play their stuff, the stuff they did years ago, they're still cool.

    Pink is one of the perfect examples. When she first came out her studio amangers etc... told her to be an R&B singer, look a certian way etc... She had talent but it didn't matter becuase she wasn't being herself. Nowadays she does the music she wants, looks how she wants and is massively famous for it, ver successful financially andagain, I like some of her stuff. U and Ur hand and Levae me ALone I like. I think they are cool. songs.

    Anyway, I'm done with this. You have your opinion, and I have mine. We don't have to agree and I doubt when it comes ot this we ever will. So peace bro.
    "What consumes your mind, controls your life" - So, what consumes your mind?

  15. #15
    Shazane Guest

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    I didn't say Bodom is better than Zeppelin, I said they are as or more talented, talent isnt an opinion, it is a statistic, Alexi Laiho can play faster and with more complexity than Jimmy Page; not opinion, fact. Not about my preferences at all, I like them both.

    And your points kind of contradict, Metallica was only good when they played their own style of songs, not a style someone else came up with, and Pink was only good when she did what she wanted to and not what other people made for her.

    And forgive me if I'm a little extreme about Aguilera, I just have a problem with American celebrities due to what garbage our society has become.

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shazane View Post
    I didn't say Bodom is better than Zeppelin, I said they are as or more talented, talent isnt an opinion, it is a statistic, Alexi Laiho can play faster and with more complexity than Jimmy Page; not opinion, fact. Not about my preferences at all, I like them both.
    Wrong. Because Alexi Laiho plays songs more complex or faster than Jimmy Page doesn't make him a better guitarist. Page restricted himself in songs so that the melody bled through, not so that everyone would go 'HELLS BELLS LOOK HOW BLOODY FAST HE'S PLAYING!'. Somehow I can't see Stairway to Heaven being a melodic death metal classic, yet everyone says it is an amazing song. Having the discipline to restrict yourself so that you can make an amazing song and not something going at a million miles an hour is good. But if he really wanted to play, he could play. He probably has more skill then Alexi Laiho, he just doesn't show it in his songs as obviously as he must.
    Today, on Ethel The Frog...

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    [QUOTE=Shazane;40097]I didn't say Bodom is better than Zeppelin, I said they are as or more talented, talent isnt an opinion, it is a statistic, Alexi Laiho can play faster and with more complexity than Jimmy Page; not opinion, fact. Not about my preferences at all, I like them both.
    [/QUOTE/]

    How quick you are isnt the barameter for musical talent. If it was, wouldnt Asafa Powell be the most talanted person in the world? And Tim Waterson would be the most talanted drummer?

    Im sure we can all agree thats not true?

  18. #18
    Shazane Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ethel_The_Frog View Post
    Wrong. Because Alexi Laiho plays songs more complex or faster than Jimmy Page doesn't make him a better guitarist. Page restricted himself in songs so that the melody bled through, not so that everyone would go 'HELLS BELLS LOOK HOW BLOODY FAST HE'S PLAYING!'. Somehow I can't see Stairway to Heaven being a melodic death metal classic, yet everyone says it is an amazing song. Having the discipline to restrict yourself so that you can make an amazing song and not something going at a million miles an hour is good. But if he really wanted to play, he could play. He probably has more skill then Alexi Laiho, he just doesn't show it in his songs as obviously as he must.
    Alexi also restricts himself at times, not all of their songs are Kissing the Shadows, especially if you look at their first album, it had alot of melodic black metal without the insane complexity as Follow the Reaper. So by their raw capability to play the guitar, regardless of what they happen to do with it, I'd have to say Alexi is more talented. I honestly dont believe that it could take more skill to play more simplistically, it's purely illogical, both of my guitarists have never found this to be the case, and it isnt that case for me on the drums either, I dont know where that idea comes from.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shazane View Post
    There are bands as talented or more talented than Deep Purple and Led Zeppelin today, yes. Take Children of Bodom.

    Kill me, now!!

  20. #20
    Shazane Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roaddebris View Post
    Kill me, now!!
    If you say so. Where do you live?

  21. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shazane
    And your points kind of contradict, Metallica was only good when they played their own style of songs, not a style someone else came up with, and Pink was only good when she did what she wanted to and not what other people made for her.
    That was what I was saying. As long as the performer and the songs match. The singer and the song fits who they are. That is the one time where the manufactured aspect of music bothers me.

    Also, I understand what your saying about the guitarists, and I don't think you are trying to detract from Jimmy Page, because without him (and others like him) the guys you look at today probably wouldn't have come about. It took someone to develop those techniques and show people the next stage, like ZP and Deep Purple did, for what we have today to come about. So in that regards, as far as complexity and speed etc... goes, there are plenty of guys out there today you could say are "better" than Jimmy Page.

    I can't comment on the Alexi bloke - becuase I have no idea who he is, however, if I was gonna compare I'd say Satriani - no one I've heard touches that guy. Yes there are faster, but they don't have the same musicality or feel or brilliance that Satriani has. That's just my opinion.

    As far as drummers go - every metal drummer I have ever heard, with very few excpetions, can play ballads and other styles. Not saying they can't, just saying in general. If you have taken the time to learn to play more htan just blast beats, and speed etc... that's great and I'm glad you did, but allot of them out there don't, and when I hear them try to play anything else, they struggle with timing and the feel of the song, whihc is what it's all about. Same with guitarists. I knew this guy who was blindingly quick, shred like you wouldn't beleive, but give him some slower stuff, that still had intricate leads, and he just couldn't get himself around it. The muscle memeroy just wasn't there to maintain things at a different feel and tempo and style. There are of course exceptions.
    "What consumes your mind, controls your life" - So, what consumes your mind?

  22. #22
    Shazane Guest

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    I guess what I'm trying to say is that music is constantly evolving, so it isnt right to say that someone is better because they invented a technique than someone who uses it, because the next generation guitarist, if they are talented , will expand on it and probably invent something new themselves, so that each generation is better than the last. Just like Morihei Ueshiba's philosophy on the martial arts.

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    Ueshiba was a hack. He was the Hanna Montana of martial arts, while Kanbun Uechi was the Angus Young of Karate.

  24. #24
    Shazane Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Roaddebris View Post
    Ueshiba was a hack. He was the Hanna Montana of martial arts, while Kanbun Uechi was the Angus Young of Karate.
    No way, O-Sensei Ueshiba was a genius, he practically reinvented grappling and knew alot about Ki and about using the human body to its potential, he was incredible, one of the greatest martial artists who ever lived. Uechi was impressive, but nowhere near as revolutionary. Not to mention the fact that Okinawan Karate has the exact weaknesses that Aikido most effectively exploits.

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    If Ueshiba were a guitar, he'd be a Squire Hello Kitty Caster.

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