Buying a custom kit

[markthechuck]

Hey everyone
Just after a bit of advice, I've been in contact with someone from AD Drums over here with the look of possibly buying a kit from them, thing is I would have to sell my new Black Panther - Black Widow kit, the custom kit would be 22, 14, 12 where as I have. 22, 16, 14, 12,10 and superb quality, do you reckon it would be a mistake?

Would you do it?

Cheers Mark

[Northern Redneck]

Why move sideways?

[rickthedrummer]

Yes.

[markthechuck]

Yes.

yes a mistake or yes you'd do it?

[rickthedrummer]

yes a mistake or yes you'd do it?

Yes, it would be a mistake.

You have a nice set. Why change?

You don't fix what ain't broken.

[Dodeska]

AD make some beautiful drums & I've drooled over a few of their sets they posted online, but I think it'd be a mistake at the moment unless you really hate your Black Widow kit.
You haven't had it long, so is it the look you want to change or the sound? Or both?
Will a custom kit sound that much better than what you already have to justify the loss in number of drums &/or the added expense?
As AD can make the kit to your design I see it as the final destination rather than a step on a journey of trying to find the perfect set-up.

[markthechuck]

cheers Fella's i think it's just more the "Custom" kit than anything, all sparkly and different, nothing wrong with my kit, just a wide eyed moment.

[kickinit]

The loss of the two toms would be a deal breaker for me personally... Unless you just never use them.

[itchie]

you know what is unique about AD?

nothing ....!

really?

yes ...they are just like all the other "custom drums" ...90% terrible 10% bla

[crispycritters]

Interesting question Mark, when you play your Black Panther - Black Widow kit do you use all of it or just play 1 up, 1 down? I would only consider it if you only play 1 up, 1 down, and you are willing to take a big loss on the Panther/Widow. Personally I would find it difficult to do - especially considering the short time you have owned it.

Although custom made kits are made to drool over I'm not that convinced that they will actually sound better - and once it acquires a few scuffs and dings (unless it never leaves your home) your enthusiasm may wane. Maybe its the attraction of owning something unique that's tugging at your wallet strings. When car manufacturers release limited edition models they don't seem to remain desirable for long, most of the time its just a special paint job and a few pounds weight reduction, and there's always a new special model released about 6 months later. Sometimes I believe its always good to have a drum kit to drool over but not necessarily own. I would like to own a high end Gretsch or DW kit but in reality I would quite happily settle for a Saturn, Starclassic or similar level Pearl shell pack - unless I win big on the National Lottery.

On a different note - do you prefer your Saturns to your Panther/Widow kit, or do you find them similar?

[porkpieguy]

I usually buy things out of need as opposed to want, so I have to ask this: What will this new custom kit do that your current kit won't?

[marko138]

I think the BP is one of the sickest kits out there. Sound incredible and look incredible. A custom...I used to be all about them. But for what? Their is no return on the initial investment. You'll never get out of it what you paid or even close to it if you decide to sell.

At this point in my life I'd take a top shelf kit from ANY of the major manufacturers over a custom every day of the week. The custom stuff just doesn't do anything for me that a Starclassic, Black Panther, Master, Collectors, etc don't do.

[markthechuck]

Interesting question Mark, when you play your Black Panther - Black Widow kit do you use all of it or just play 1 up, 1 down? I would only consider it if you only play 1 up, 1 down, and you are willing to take a big loss on the Panther/Widow. Personally I would find it difficult to do - especially considering the short time you have owned it.

Although custom made kits are made to drool over I'm not that convinced that they will actually sound better - and once it acquires a few scuffs and dings (unless it never leaves your home) your enthusiasm may wane. Maybe its the attraction of owning something unique that's tugging at your wallet strings. When car manufacturers release limited edition models they don't seem to remain desirable for long, most of the time its just a special paint job and a few pounds weight reduction, and there's always a new special model released about 6 months later. Sometimes I believe its always good to have a drum kit to drool over but not necessarily own. I would like to own a high end Gretsch or DW kit but in reality I would quite happily settle for a Saturn, Starclassic or similar level Pearl shell pack - unless I win big on the National Lottery.

On a different note - do you prefer your Saturns to your Panther/Widow kit, or do you find them similar?

i think your right, it's just a drool over kit the novelty will wear off, i'm going to stick with my Black Widow, i think a couple of years wait for something like a DW is a lot more realistic.

You can tell the Saturn had a little more punch but that had a walnut/birch mix, The B/W is all Maple, the 14" Floor tom is the best sounding tom i've ever heard, the whole kit is so easy to tune too as well.
i do only use the 12 and 14 but it's nice to have the other 2 just in case.

[markthechuck]

I think the BP is one of the sickest kits out there. Sound incredible and look incredible. A custom...I used to be all about them. But for what? Their is no return on the initial investment. You'll never get out of it what you paid or even close to it if you decide to sell.

At this point in my life I'd take a top shelf kit from ANY of the major manufacturers over a custom every day of the week. The custom stuff just doesn't do anything for me that a Starclassic, Black Panther, Master, Collectors, etc don't do.

i saw a highwood kit for £350 on FB the other week, that would have easily cost £1500 probably more.

[markthechuck]

I usually buy things out of need as opposed to want, so I have to ask this: What will this new custom kit do that your current kit won't?

absolutely nothing at all lol, i wish i was more like that, i'd save a fortune.

[markthechuck]

The loss of the two toms would be a deal breaker for me personally... Unless you just never use them.

i'm 1 up 1 down at the minute but was 2 up 1 down a couple of weeks ago, i'll be 1 up 2 down knowing me in a few weeks.

[Bish]

I think you are like me. Always looking for that elusive something that really doesn't exist. You have one of the finest drum kits ever.

Keep what you have and just make it yours. Some day I might even take that advice.

Case in point, I'm heading to GC this weekend to unload another kit that I never play.

[porkpieguy]

At this point in my life I'd take a top shelf kit from ANY of the major manufacturers over a custom every day of the week. The custom stuff just doesn't do anything for me that a Starclassic, Black Panther, Master, Collectors, etc don't do.

I like the idea of Bill Detmore at PP cutting the edges on each of the custom drums himself, and many drummers have sent their top shelf kits from major manufacturers to Bill for him to re-cut their edges.

With that said, there are some really amazing top-shelf kits from major manufacturers that I would be more than happy and proud to play. As a matter of fact, I remember MDK posting a video of his Sonor Beechwood drums, and I swear those things haunt me to this day.

[marko138]

I like the idea of Bill Detmore at PP cutting the edges on each of the custom drums himself, and many drummers have sent their top shelf kits from major manufacturers to Bill for him to re-cut their edges.

With that said, there are some really amazing top-shelf kits from major manufacturers that I would be more than happy and proud to play. As a matter of fact, I remember MDK posting a video of his Sonor Beechwood drums, and I swear those things haunt me to this day.

I love PP stuff too man. I kinda think of them somewhere between the big dogs and the custom shops. IDK...maybe I'm off base there.

[weezy]

Have you ever noticed all the custom kits on eBay that the seller is taking an absolute beating on? The only thing that's truly custom on most of them is the finish. At their core, most of them are shells you could get anywhere.

[porkpieguy]

Have you ever noticed all the custom kits on eBay that the seller is taking an absolute beating on?

No pun intended, right?

But to answer your question, my answer is yes. Most of all, I'm pretty sure the primary reason has to do with the economy and simply supply/demand. A friend of mine is a custom guitar builder who's actually getting quite a name for himself. His guitars are AMAZING, but the one critique I have is that whenever he does a custom build, on the label inside he writes "Custom made for (person's name goes here)." When these guitars get sold, there's just something about paying a premium on a custom guitar that was made for someone else. Same goes for drums with me. It's like, "Man, I love that custom OCDP set from the late 1990s, but I'm not sure about the white finish with the bright orange racing stripe." It's like you sort of have to settle for whatever someone else has ordered and, in a way, "put up with" the customization that you may not have decided on yourself.

Not trying to open a can of worms here, but I can't help but think that another thing that's driving down prices is the "cheapening" of what-used-to-be higher-end brand names. At one point, having the OCDP logo on the front head sort of meant something (as did Pork Pie, DW, Spaun, etc.), but now with all of these lower-line kits coming out, I wonder if your average buyer knows the difference between, say, a beat-up custom OCDP kit from the late 90's as opposed to a brand new OCDP Avalon kit? You know, like "Why would I pay $900 for a 15-year-old 4-piece OCDP kit when I can get brand new 6-piece OCDP Avalon kit for the same price, right?" I know that there's a thread about this somewhere.

The only thing that's truly custom on most of them is the finish. At their core, most of them are shells you could get anywhere.

When it comes to Keller shells, yes, I think you are right. However, having a nice edges is super-important and I'm not about to do this myself. Also, when finishing a drum kit, there is a certain margin of error that I'm going to have to deal with when doing this myself as opposed to getting a another builder to do it. There's a local guy here that builds keller kits for a fraction of the cost of other builders. He learned to cut his edges from the late owner of Phattie drums which started making a name for himself before he passed away. He knows what he's doing with a set of shells, and I do not. I'd be much more likely to trust him (or another drum company) to put them together. I think this is what you pay for.

[weezy]

Correct. No pun intended.

There's definitely plenty of people out there that don't realize the difference in the attention to detail from a "real" OCDP kit and the GC house brand kits of today.

My comment wasn't really meant to get into the whole entry, intermediate, pro thing. It was simply my observation that if you sell a custom pro kit a few years down the road, you'll loose a higher percentage of what you paid than you would selling a regular production pro kit.

I imagine that the same trend will pop up in the intermediate market when mydentity kits start hitting the used market. I'd be willing to bet that a Meridian will have a better return on investment than a mydentity, but we'll have to wait a few years to see if I'm right.

[marko138]

No pun intended, right?

But to answer your question, my answer is yes. Most of all, I'm pretty sure the primary reason has to do with the economy and simply supply/demand. A friend of mine is a custom guitar builder who's actually getting quite a name for himself. His guitars are AMAZING, but the one critique I have is that whenever he does a custom build, on the label inside he writes "Custom made for (person's name goes here)." When these guitars get sold, there's just something about paying a premium on a custom guitar that was made for someone else. Same goes for drums with me. It's like, "Man, I love that custom OCDP set from the late 1990s, but I'm not sure about the white finish with the bright orange racing stripe." It's like you sort of have to settle for whatever someone else has ordered and, in a way, "put up with" the customization that you may not have decided on yourself.

Not trying to open a can of worms here, but I can't help but think that another thing that's driving down prices is the "cheapening" of what-used-to-be higher-end brand names. At one point, having the OCDP logo on the front head sort of meant something (as did Pork Pie, DW, Spaun, etc.), but now with all of these lower-line kits coming out, I wonder if your average buyer knows the difference between, say, a beat-up custom OCDP kit from the late 90's as opposed to a brand new OCDP Avalon kit? You know, like "Why would I pay $900 for a 15-year-old 4-piece OCDP kit when I can get brand new 6-piece OCDP Avalon kit for the same price, right?" I know that there's a thread about this somewhere.




When it comes to Keller shells, yes, I think you are right. However, having a nice edges is super-important and I'm not about to do this myself. Also, when finishing a drum kit, there is a certain margin of error that I'm going to have to deal with when doing this myself as opposed to getting a another builder to do it. There's a local guy here that builds keller kits for a fraction of the cost of other builders. He learned to cut his edges from the late owner of Phattie drums which started making a name for himself before he passed away. He knows what he's doing with a set of shells, and I do not. I'd be much more likely to trust him (or another drum company) to put them together. I think this is what you pay for.

I'm not sure the debate is over who cuts better edges. Of course you and I don't know how to cut edges like a custom company. But point is moot when you compare edges from a custom company and a major player like DW, Tama, Pearl, etc. That's apples to apples.

When you compare those two, all you are paying for is the finish, like weezy said. The shells, at their core, are nearly identical across the board of custom makers, since most of them come from Keller.

[porkpieguy]

I'm not sure the debate is over who cuts better edges. Of course you and I don't know how to cut edges like a custom company. But point is moot when you compare edges from a custom company and a major player like DW, Tama, Pearl, etc. That's apples to apples.

IMO, you are correct. I think that once you get to a certain quality level and price point, I don't think that there really is a better edge. I think it's more sound preference than anything.

When you compare those two, all you are paying for is the finish, like weezy said. The shells, at their core, are nearly identical across the board of custom makers, since most of them come from Keller.

I think you are not only paying for the finish, but you are paying for the logo on the badges and the front kick drum head as well.

[porkpieguy]

My comment wasn't really meant to get into the whole entry, intermediate, pro thing. It was simply my observation that if you sell a custom pro kit a few years down the road, you'll loose a higher percentage of what you paid than you would selling a regular production pro kit.

Yup, I believe you are correct. To me the lesson here is if you order a custom kit, MAKE SURE that it's going to be something that you plan to either keep forever or at least a very, very long time. I see people taking a bath when they sell their custom acoustic guitars. I've seen people lose thousands, and it's a shame.

I imagine that the same trend will pop up in the intermediate market when mydentity kits start hitting the used market. I'd be willing to bet that a Meridian will have a better return on investment than a mydentity, but we'll have to wait a few years to see if I'm right.

I think that you are right. At the same time, personally, I think the idea of mydentity drums is quite genius. You get to pick your colors and sizes while still paying a fair price, but my prediction is that they probably won't get anywhere near the price they paid new.


I guess another lesson here is to for folks to consider buying used custom kits while the "gettin' is good!"