Your opinion on backing tracks?

[SuperFortress]

There are apparently only three keyboardists in my state and each of them is already in 7 different bands. So after months of trying to find a keyboardist we've decided to alter our setlist slightly and use a key/synth backing track on a few songs. I have never liked the idea but am becoming okay with it. We're a three piece and the other guys are incredibly talented. The setlist is great and there aren't any tracks where the keyboards are going crazy while the guitar and bass just stand there clearly NOT doing anything. Anyway, your opinion?

[FlayOtters]

Backing tracks are fine. Whatever it takes to do justice to the song and the venue.
The only problem with playing to a backing track is you have to get everything right.
You can't busk along and feel it, you have to hit every note and stay right on the beat.
In fact, the Who play(ed) to extensive backing tracks (esp. horns played by Entwistle). At one concert Townsend stopped in the middle of the song and made them start over because they were out with the backing track.

[jedi]

Yea ... been there , done that , and I'm a much better player for it . I really don't see anything wrong with "..you have to get everything right " or ..you have to hit every note and stay on the beat " . Don't you do that on the gig anyway ? Well maybe not but you will and you will be a much better player for it . Train wrecks are going to happen , maybe , in the beginning but you learn and move on . Don't let that stop you , everybody makes mistakes .
The band I'm in is having the same problem .. we can't find a keyboard player . And yea the ones that are around are in two or three other bands already ! I'm thinking maybe I should switch instruments .. HA ! We're a three piece as well but we've decided against using backing tracks because the guitar player can't play "in the pocket" (if you know what I mean) and he and the lead singer can't remember parts and sometimes make them up on the spot . That's a big No No if you're playing to backing tracks . So for us it would be a disaster ! But if you think you and your band mates are capable I say go for it . You won't lose any gigs if it don't work out . We've been gig without a keyboard player for about a year now and we've not lost a gig because of it . And we play 3-4 times a week every week . But we would sound so much better if we did have a keyboard player or backing tracks .
You already seem to know what's involved so I say give it a shot .
Rudy .

[FlayOtters]

snip
we've decided against using backing tracks because the guitar player can't play "in the pocket" (if you know what I mean) and he and the lead singer can't remember parts and sometimes make them up on the spot .
Snip

There it is!
As I probably should have said, you all have to have your stuff together dead on balls, or the whole thing goes off the rails quickly.

[Tadman]

^^Yup, no improvising, skipping parts, coming in early, etc., and the backing track needs to be clear in the mix to enable follow along. If it is not a long part or long series of parts, I have even created phrases with "stop/start" function on a sampler (I have the Roland vsn) to avoid disasters.

[8beat]

Your guitar player can't stomp on one of his/her boxes and make organ or sax sounds?

[EddieV]

I love playing with tracks. Especially with a lot of the new stuff that's out there.

[NewTricks]

Your guitar player can't stomp on one of his/her boxes and make organ or sax sounds?

Not when he is playing his guitar parts


I stated using/writing backing tracks a few years ago for the same reasons as the OP. A great keyboard player would be nice but they just aren't available.

Besides the added sound, it helps everyone learn to stay in tempo.

Yup, no improvising,

You can allow for improvisation by segmenting the tracks but it is much easier just to run them straight through.

the backing track needs to be clear in the mix to enable follow along.

That was the case in the first two bands I used them. In the current project, the tracks are a bit more subtle and often get lost in the mix. That's where the click comes into play and everyone must follow the drummer. When you have good, experienced players, it's pretty easy. If you have a couple of people constantly pulling you left and right of the click, it's a struggle.


The trick in the songs with strictly keys playing at the into (like the one below) is to have your frontman talking, to distract from the fact that no one is playing the part. This comes into play on only a few songs we do.

https://soundcloud.com/sick-of-the-game

My theory is that if/when we run into a a great KB player, he could step in at any time. Until then, we will move ahead using tracks.

[SuperFortress]

Your guitar player can't stomp on one of his/her boxes and make organ or sax sounds?

As NewTricks said, he's going to be doing his parts. We want to fill the sound out and there just aren't any keyboard players available in this area.

My theory is that if/when we run into a a great KB player, he could step in at any time. Until then, we will move ahead using tracks.

Pretty much. We could either spend the next year playing in the basement while looking for a keyboard player or just start playing out with tracks and add keys if/when they come along.

[NewTricks]

Let me warn you though, you will get spoiled.

The keyboard will always play the right parts, always be available for rehearsal/gigs and he doesn't take a cut of the big money we all get

[jedi]

Let me warn you though, you will get spoiled.

The keyboard will always play the right parts, always be available for rehearsal/gigs and he doesn't take a cut of the big money we all get

A big AMEN to that !!

[SuperFortress]

Let me warn you though, you will get spoiled.

The keyboard will always play the right parts, always be available for rehearsal/gigs and he doesn't take a cut of the big money we all get

Well then I'm forming a one man band and playing along to karaoke tracks.

[kay-gee]

Well then I'm forming a one man band and playing along to karaoke tracks.

Why not? In fact, why not just have a DJ come in play tracks that are perfectly syncronized, in perfect tune, and on tempo, and send the musicians home?

all the best...

[SuperFortress]

Why not? In fact, why not just have a DJ come in play tracks that are perfectly syncronized, in perfect tune, and on tempo, and send the musicians home?

all the best...

OR ---- have people bring their own music and just mail me the cash!!!

[rickthedrummer]

We were fortunate enough to have a really good keyboard player.

The downside: He had a Hammond B3 and a Leslie. Both of which can give you a hernia just looking at them.

[joecut]

We were fortunate enough to have a really good keyboard player.

The downside: He had a Hammond B3 and a Leslie. Both of which can give you a hernia just looking at them.

Heavy, yes, but the sound is unlike any other. Can not be replicated by electronica, IMO.

[FlayOtters]

How about this...
You get a guy to run the samples/tracks.
He could be any kind of musician, maybe another guitarist (they're ten a penny ).
But his job would be to manage and run the backing tracks.
That song "How You Like Me Now" by the Heavy is entirely a backing track. Literally, almost the whole song is sampled from a song by Dyke and the Blazers, a 60s funk/soul band.
Watching The Heavy play I saw they had a keyboard guy who must have been running the sample - he certainly wasn't playing keyboards.
In fact sample player/backing track guy/noise maker used to be a legitimate band member function; think DikMik or Bryan Eno.
You need a guy that pushes buttons on a panel and has a Revox running behind his head, old school. It's just natural.

[FlayOtters]

We were fortunate enough to have a really good keyboard player.
The downside: He had a Hammond B3 and a Leslie. Both of which can give you a hernia just looking at them.

Yeah I played with an amazing organist back in the 70s. He could play stride bass with his feet while jamming. It was a lot of fun. But humping that massive organ into the van was almost not worth it.

[SuperFortress]

How about this...
You get a guy to run the samples/tracks.

Right now that's me. I'm triggering the tracks and have the click on a separate channel running to everyone's in-ears.

[drummerMD]

Here is a example of one being used in a Argentina 'Garbage tribute band' The song is PUSH.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbpX525qaUE

[drummerMD]

The song is PUSH IT. . . .sorry.

[jedi]

Right now that's me. I'm triggering the tracks and have the click on a separate channel running to everyone's in-ears.

What are you using for the sequencer ?
I have the Roland SPD-S into a pocket sized mixer and a powered speaker . How I set it up depends on the song . If it's a ballad with lots of piano then we play to the sequence from beginning to end . But on some of the dance stuff like Earth Wind and Fire or Rick James stuff where we just need the horns then it's different . What I do is program a percussion part like a cowbell and some congas looped on one pad . So that's pretty much the click that we all play to . Then I have horn parts sampled on different pads that I trigger . See ..if we get away from the click then I just don't trigger that pad thus avoiding a disaster . I can take the part out and we do the song without the horns . Or if the singer starts to sing the chorus twice in a row or stretches the song out because the dance floor is hopping then I just hit the appropriate pads with the right parts again . We're not so locked to a sequence . But we do have to stay with that percussion part . We had it worked out really well .

[NPYYZ]

We were fortunate enough to have a really good keyboard player.

The downside: He had a Hammond B3 and a Leslie. Both of which can give you a hernia just looking at them.

Been there, my back twinged just reading that.

[SuperFortress]

What are you using for the sequencer ?
I have the Roland SPD-S into a pocket sized mixer and a powered speaker . How I set it up depends on the song . If it's a ballad with lots of piano then we play to the sequence from beginning to end . But on some of the dance stuff like Earth Wind and Fire or Rick James stuff where we just need the horns then it's different . What I do is program a percussion part like a cowbell and some congas looped on one pad . So that's pretty much the click that we all play to . Then I have horn parts sampled on different pads that I trigger . See ..if we get away from the click then I just don't trigger that pad thus avoiding a disaster . I can take the part out and we do the song without the horns . Or if the singer starts to sing the chorus twice in a row or stretches the song out because the dance floor is hopping then I just hit the appropriate pads with the right parts again . We're not so locked to a sequence . But we do have to stay with that percussion part . We had it worked out really well .

I'm using a SamplePad to trigger the full track out to an XR18. Click is on the left and keys on the right. Our setlist doesn't have anything especially complex so I don't need to trigger additional loops, hits or phrases.