Have you thought about trying a coated singe/double ply or a coated power center batter?
So I bought this used PDP hammered bronze snare a while back (14x5). I got it mainly because it was a real phosphor bronze shell at a ridiculous price $130 cdn +tax (~$100 US). I was tired of my stock wood snare and thought metal would pop more but was scared steel would be too far in the bright rock camp. Anyway, I played around with heads, tuning and snare wires and am never quite happy. I'm sure some of you can relate...
Currently I have Evans UV1 over 300 and Grover club wires FWIW (I like the sensitivity of the thinner jazz but there's not enough projection). What I like about the drum is it has a "quicker" response than wood, it pops without being too bright/ugly. I am going for a rich sound, not necessarily rock or jazz, just tasteful/musical. Lately I prefer lower tuning, roughly the same pitch as my 12" tom (highest). I have the reso up pretty high to get the wires to respond nice & quick.
My journey with heads was as follows: got Evans EC2S because I thought overtones were bad initially. In reality it was because I didn't know how to tune properly (now I can). I started to hate the excessive attack and figured single play was the way to go. Got all Calftones, then UV1s. Now I'm only having trouble with the snare, wondering what to do. I use moongels on & off but there's a ring/whine that I can't live with, is it the shell? The heads? The moron tuning the drum? Should I revisit dry or 2-ply heads? Open to suggestions... thanks!
Taye Tourperformer, PDP Hammered bronze snare, 15" Diril Primitive hats, 17" XPlosion, 10" duo splash, 15" Xtreme china, 22" HHX Omni, 7" cup chime, Yamaha 9415 w. Vickicks
Have you thought about trying a coated singe/double ply or a coated power center batter?
First you have to know what you're working with. Metal shelled drums are going to have more overtones right off the bat, some like it some don't.
As far as sound goes.. copper = dark(lows) / bronze = warm(mids) / steel = bright(highs)
However, aluminum snares tend to be bright, but a dry version of that.
Head choice is subjective, but I always liked thin heads(such as remo diplomat) for the snare side, and plain ol coated single ply(such as remo ambassador or evans g1) for the batter head.
Combinations like that should do you pretty well, as long as you tune it evenly. Personally I never liked low tunings much because I found a nasty buzz would exist there, so I generally stuck with mid, sometimes high depending on the drum. The only one that annoyed me to tune was the floor tom, hahaha.
ZildjianLeague/LP/Aquarian/Mapex/Pearl
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No metronome?
The Rudiments
Try a popsicle stick. Seriously!!
YOU MESS WITH THE DEVIL YOU KNOW.
YOU DON'T MESS WITH THE DEVIL YOU DON'T KNOW.
VAE VICTIS
ONCE YOU HIT A CERTAIN AGE, YOU BECOME PERMANENTLY UNIMPRESSED BY A LOT OF CRAP.
I HIT THAT AGE 20 YEARS AGO.
IF DOGS CAN'T GO TO HEAVEN, I WANT TO GO WHERE THEY GO
WILL ROGERS
Thanks guys. This afternoon I brought the tuning up higher on both heads (more on the batter) because it was already as low as I thought safe. It actually reduced the whine quite a bit. I've had this drum sounding better than this but obviously I changed something and struggling to get back. So I went to the local store looking for a Genera head. They didn't have any so they sold me the Remo equivalent, a coated PS3. I just got it on and playing with the tuning some. I hear the difference but there's still plenty of ring happening... (that's kind of a good thing because I was afraid to kill this lively drum with a muffled head). I'm starting to think the whine is due to the interval between the 2 heads... Will fool around with more tunings tomorrow.
Taye Tourperformer, PDP Hammered bronze snare, 15" Diril Primitive hats, 17" XPlosion, 10" duo splash, 15" Xtreme china, 22" HHX Omni, 7" cup chime, Yamaha 9415 w. Vickicks
i'd just switch to one of my other 50 snares if I got mad lol
What hoops are on it?
My favorite snare head is the Evans Dry.
It has all the port holes around it. LOVE IT
I've got the stock triple flange hoops on it but admit I'm curious what other styles might sound like.
Taye Tourperformer, PDP Hammered bronze snare, 15" Diril Primitive hats, 17" XPlosion, 10" duo splash, 15" Xtreme china, 22" HHX Omni, 7" cup chime, Yamaha 9415 w. Vickicks
Aquarian anything tends to sound good to me, but the other brands have perfectly good heads that will make it work. Don't use too thick a head on snare side, and it will respond very well. Remember the star pattern when tuning, it will save you.
ZildjianLeague/LP/Aquarian/Mapex/Pearl
Snares: 4
RIP- Frank, Wolvie, Les Paul
Forum Rules
DrumBum
No metronome?
The Rudiments
Ok I think I got it figured out. Without meaning to, I had cranked my reso head past a reasonable tension and it was choking. I backed off and things are making more sense. The P3 head seems to reduce ~30-40% of the ring, so there's still some life in the sound. It's not as responsive as the UV1, I thought for sure it was thicker but no they're both 10 mil. I am seriously considering a tune bot now...
Taye Tourperformer, PDP Hammered bronze snare, 15" Diril Primitive hats, 17" XPlosion, 10" duo splash, 15" Xtreme china, 22" HHX Omni, 7" cup chime, Yamaha 9415 w. Vickicks
I did use Diplomats as batter heads on all my snares for a long time and still do, but I have tried other heads just for the hell of it.
All my snares are metal and the popsicle stick cures the ring.
YOU MESS WITH THE DEVIL YOU KNOW.
YOU DON'T MESS WITH THE DEVIL YOU DON'T KNOW.
VAE VICTIS
ONCE YOU HIT A CERTAIN AGE, YOU BECOME PERMANENTLY UNIMPRESSED BY A LOT OF CRAP.
I HIT THAT AGE 20 YEARS AGO.
IF DOGS CAN'T GO TO HEAVEN, I WANT TO GO WHERE THEY GO
WILL ROGERS
I think you have the wrong snare for the sound you describe (and too loose a tuning for that snare, maybe), but here's something that is certainly worth trying: cotton balls in the shell. Just stuff two or more in thru the vent hole. Goodbye ring. Promise. Cheap, easy, and easily reversible if you don't like it. (Works on toms, too.)
GeeDeeEmm
ZildjianLeague/LP/Aquarian/Mapex/Pearl
Snares: 4
RIP- Frank, Wolvie, Les Paul
Forum Rules
DrumBum
No metronome?
The Rudiments
Will definitely try that!
Since that post earlier today, I wanted more fatness so brought the tuning lower on the reso but here's what I don't get:
I tune one head up, I tune one head down. I try the other head up, then brought her down. I tighten the snare wires, I loosen the snare wires. All throughout this exercise, I hear the ring come and go, usually in the same register or narrow range. The only thing that always kills the ring/whine is moongel but it is too dead for my liking... Am I being too fussy or just not scientific enough in my tuning approach?
I have had this snare sounding near perfect before but I clearly changed something and can't seem to get it back.
Taye Tourperformer, PDP Hammered bronze snare, 15" Diril Primitive hats, 17" XPlosion, 10" duo splash, 15" Xtreme china, 22" HHX Omni, 7" cup chime, Yamaha 9415 w. Vickicks
You don’t plug the hole, you push them through so the cotton is inside....just laying there on the inside of the reso head. When you hit the drum, the balls dance around inside the drum....they act as a type of sound “gate” to shorten the sustain without killing the initial sound.
That’s the thing about moongel, mufflers, rings, tape and pre-dampened heads. They are always “on”, which can choke the sound.
It works particularly well on floor toms.
-Brian
"Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"
Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!
"I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham
There's that rocket science again.
Cotton balls, this is the best drummers can come up with. WOW!!!!!
YOU MESS WITH THE DEVIL YOU KNOW.
YOU DON'T MESS WITH THE DEVIL YOU DON'T KNOW.
VAE VICTIS
ONCE YOU HIT A CERTAIN AGE, YOU BECOME PERMANENTLY UNIMPRESSED BY A LOT OF CRAP.
I HIT THAT AGE 20 YEARS AGO.
IF DOGS CAN'T GO TO HEAVEN, I WANT TO GO WHERE THEY GO
WILL ROGERS
What N2Bluz said - the cotton balls pop up OFF the reso when the drum is struck, then back down to mildly mute the head. It's like a short electronic gate. Start with one cotton ball and add more as needed.
GeeDeeEmm
-Brian
"Too many crappy used drum stuff to list"
Play the SONG......not the DRUMS!!!
"I think that feeling is a lot more important than technique. It's all very well doing a triple paradiddle - but who's going to know you've done it? If you play technically you sound like everybody else. It's being original that counts." ~ John Bonham
My first thought is that (in my experience) a bronze shell is usually easy to tune up.
I always crank it tight when the ring is stubborn.
Gretsch USA & Zildjian(What Else Would I Ever Need ?)
Man, I got some time to really tune it in and frankly it was pissing me off! I somehow got one lug way too high and never noticed or heard it. I took the reso off and started from scratch. I decided not to try anything different, just the usual high tension and get the batter at a pitch I can live with. For good measure I put the steel Puresound wires back on. The batter is a major 3rd above my high tom, reso nearly cranked but not choked. This is the combination I always arrived at before I began messing with lower tunings. I don't know what my problem is, it's like I'm easily confused by overtones. Can't identify the fundamental or something... Next time I can spare $100 I'm getting a Tune Bot... can't keep doing this to myself Regarding the PS3, I only really hear it controlling overtones a bit, giving a larger "dead" range near the center. There is still plenty of ring happening.
Last edited by Natman; 09-19-2018 at 07:55 PM.
Taye Tourperformer, PDP Hammered bronze snare, 15" Diril Primitive hats, 17" XPlosion, 10" duo splash, 15" Xtreme china, 22" HHX Omni, 7" cup chime, Yamaha 9415 w. Vickicks
OCCAMS RAZOR. You don't need the JPL for this 1.
YOU MESS WITH THE DEVIL YOU KNOW.
YOU DON'T MESS WITH THE DEVIL YOU DON'T KNOW.
VAE VICTIS
ONCE YOU HIT A CERTAIN AGE, YOU BECOME PERMANENTLY UNIMPRESSED BY A LOT OF CRAP.
I HIT THAT AGE 20 YEARS AGO.
IF DOGS CAN'T GO TO HEAVEN, I WANT TO GO WHERE THEY GO
WILL ROGERS
You might try this: Use the STAR pattern ... start on the Reso head...1/2 turn each...then go an additional 1/2 turn...then go 1/4 turn ...stop. place your snare on a pillow...batter side down...lightly tap your stick about 1 1/2 inch from each tension rod...listen carefully to the tone...then go to the next tension rod to the right...tap it...etc...and get the same "Tone" at each tension rod. Once you have the same tone at all of the tension rods, turn the drum over and start on the Batter side...only this time, dont go over 3/4 of a turn on each tension rod...once you get them all at the same tone.... put it on your snare stand. Hopefully, that will put you close to a tuning you can work with. From here any tonal adjustments will be small ones...1/16 of a turn can make noticeable changes in tone when applied to all the tension rods on the heads.
My preference in heads on my snare are: Aquarian Texture Coated single ply batter head and the Aquarian Classic Clear (3 mil ) reso head. I like the lower tuning with the snare wires just tight enough so that they give a tight snare wire sound without choking the head and I play power rim shots that "Pop" during the lead rides and middle of the head during the verses. Maybe this will help...~~~
Yamaha Oak Custom 22x17 with Brass Kick Port, Brass Hoop Claws,10-12-14 racks, 16 Floor and all toms have Brass Hoops and a Tama Starclassic Bubinga Elite 14x6.5 snare in Quilted Mocha Burst and Black Nickel hardware. All hi-end Zildjian Cymbals - K Dark Thin crashes & splashes, a Zildjian A crash & a Meinl 16" crash, Avedis Zildjian 1964 ride, K Custom hats plus New Beat hats on Closed X-Hat.
If a Man offends thee - - give each of his children a Drum~~~!!!
You probably don't want to hear this, but the ring you don't like from the throne might sound awesome out front.
I crank the snare (Bottom) head up as far as it will go then play about with the batter head & then adjust the snare wires. Never had a snare that won't "Play Ball" like that
The Varukers.
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