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Thread: 12" Tom....

  1. #1

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    Default 12" Tom....

    I bought new heads today, EC2 Clears to be precise. I play a Starclassic Bubinga/Birch and I'm thinking I should have taken Bish's advice and stuck with the G2's. The 14" tom sounds decent, but my 12"x7" tom is being a real pain. Not only does it seem to have a very tight tuning range, it also sounds dead. Another annoying problem I'm having is that the drums sound great when recorded or when you hang your head over the drum, but when sitting and playing they sound completely different. Almost all of the resonance is lost when sitting at the kit. So many factors come into play including room size, materials etc. So I'm just wondering if anyone else has had a problem similar to mine.
    As of 1/7/09: Tama Starclassic Bubinga/Birch. 12", 14" 16" 20" DW Brass snare. Pearl Eliminator double bass pedal. DW 5000 hi hat stand.

    14" Sabian AA Studio Hats
    16" Sabian AA Sound Control Crash-brilliant finish
    18" K Custom Dark Crash
    20" K Custom Hybrid Ride

    Pork Pie Saddle (Purple on zebra stripe- so ugly no one will steal it!)

    Sticks: Pro Mark 5A, Shira Kashi Oak

  2. #2
    ThePloughman Guest

    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Everyone.
    You never really hear yourself playing the drums until you sit out there with the audience.

  3. #3

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Well. we all know we can't do that... So we will never know what we sound like. That's whats got me worried. I know how it sounds above and behind the kit, but in front??
    As of 1/7/09: Tama Starclassic Bubinga/Birch. 12", 14" 16" 20" DW Brass snare. Pearl Eliminator double bass pedal. DW 5000 hi hat stand.

    14" Sabian AA Studio Hats
    16" Sabian AA Sound Control Crash-brilliant finish
    18" K Custom Dark Crash
    20" K Custom Hybrid Ride

    Pork Pie Saddle (Purple on zebra stripe- so ugly no one will steal it!)

    Sticks: Pro Mark 5A, Shira Kashi Oak

  4. #4

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    You're not the only one to have that issue with the EC2's. Although I seem to take flak for it, I had the same problem. Had EC2's on my son's old set, put one on a tom of the new Superstar's and it sounded dreadful. Went back to stock.

    Just got new heads on my older Tama's and went with G2's on batter side and G1's on reso. Sound amazing. If you are going to change I think it's a safe choice.
    Jesse

    1986 Tama Crestar - Lacquered Piano White
    2016 Roland TD-25K
    2015 Tama Starclassic B/B - Indigo Blue Sparkle

  5. #5

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Why spend all that money on a high end kit and then put EC2's on it? EC's are great for low end kits. On your B/B I would run coated G1's or Ambos.

  6. #6

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    You are dealing with the age old problem what head, how to tune how do they sound etc...I use ec2's on my Pacific kit with g1's on the resonants. I get a nice full punchy sound with just the right amount of pitch bend between the batter and reso...that nice doooow sound and no annoying ring that drops about a third by drum. Your drums are not going to sound the same out front as they do sitting behind them so it is really a matter of what you are looking for in sound and where you want it to have the greatest impact....to you or those listening. We've all experienced that stubborn drum that doesn't cooperate! Also I consider EC2's a head that needs to be hit hard to reach it's full potential... that goes for any double ply head. If you are not a heavy hitter I would go for a single ply head.
    Last edited by Timmkatt; 01-23-2009 at 05:32 PM.

  7. #7

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Redneck View Post
    Why spend all that money on a high end kit and then put EC2's on it? EC's are great for low end kits. On your B/B I would run coated G1's or Ambos.
    *********************************************

    Absolutely! I used Pin Stripes, similar to the EC's, amd changed to coated Ambassadors. These let the drums sing as they were meant to and have an excellent tuning range.
    There's a lot to be said for Time Honored tradition and value.

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  8. #8

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    I also have a 7x12 BB tom with EC2's. I go one step farther and kill it it with Moon Gel. Yeah, it sounds fairly dead to the ear, but miked through the PA it sounds like GOD!


    (And I agree with Timmkatt, these heads only work if you HIT them.)

    • 1966 4-piece Ludwig Black Oyster Pearl
    • 2000 8-piece DW Collector's Grey Swirl
    • 2002 8-piece Pearl Masterworks GB Packer Gold
    • 2008 8-piece Tama B&B Lava Glass Glitter
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    • Paiste Formula 602 14, 14, 16, 18, 20


  9. #9
    Larrysperf Guest

    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    I have used remo, and others and ended up with coated EC2 on all my drums but snare and kick and love the nice low sound. Most important with these heads is to tune them to the best sound of drum. My drums sound like Phil Collins to Ginger Bakers. Nuff Said

  10. #10
    Larrysperf Guest

    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Redneck View Post
    Why spend all that money on a high end kit and then put EC2's on it? EC's are great for low end kits. On your B/B I would run coated G1's or Ambos.
    tELL dEAN bUTTERWORTH THAT

  11. #11

    User Info Menu

    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Boy, am I getting frustrated. I've always found 12" toms difficult to tune, but this is just insane. I started with brand new G1's on the reso sides, and EC2 coated on the batter. I wanted a little more resonance, so I opted for the EC2 clears, which as previously stated did the exact opposite. I picked up a G2 clear today, and still no luck. I've meticulously tuned the drum high and low, and can't get a good sound out of it.

    Now, I've had problems with the room that my drums are in. Its a basement with 7ft ceilings, and has terrible acoustics. The only drum that sounds good down there is my kick drum. To save space, I have them set up in a corner, facing towards the rest of the basement so I can also see my bandmates. The snare has never sounded good down there, but sounds great in live rooms. So I'm attributing my trouble with the tom to poor room acoustics as well. Not only may this be true, but it will also ease a little frustration on the mental end.

    I like to tune low, so I don't think single ply heads will work too well for me. What are the acoustical differences between coated and clear heads?? Obviously I can't really tell in my cardboard box basement....
    As of 1/7/09: Tama Starclassic Bubinga/Birch. 12", 14" 16" 20" DW Brass snare. Pearl Eliminator double bass pedal. DW 5000 hi hat stand.

    14" Sabian AA Studio Hats
    16" Sabian AA Sound Control Crash-brilliant finish
    18" K Custom Dark Crash
    20" K Custom Hybrid Ride

    Pork Pie Saddle (Purple on zebra stripe- so ugly no one will steal it!)

    Sticks: Pro Mark 5A, Shira Kashi Oak

  12. #12

    User Info Menu

    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    I had coated ec2's on my saturns but the 12'' tom sounded dead as well. I put clear Emporers on them and they all sound great now. Plenty of resonance and still a nice, deep tone.
    __________________________
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  13. #13

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    I have a cheap O' snare made of stainless steel that I wanted to warm up a bit. This was my first use of Evans EC1 coated batter heads. The characteristics of the head and shell worked perfectly, in fact it sounded so good I went ahead and put EC2 coated heads on the rest of my Pearl kit. The kit consists of the 14" x 5 1/2" metal snare, 12" x 8" rack tom, 13" x 9" rack tom and a 16" x 16" floor tom. The bass drum is a little 20" x 14" which had the Pearl reso head and an Evans EQ4 batter.

    This is an older set that I bought in the sixties and probably was used in hundreds of gigs by both me and my dad. When I re-headed the drums, the drums tunes right up beautifully. I still had a lot of resonance with great tones from each drum. Before I made the switch, I had Evans G1 clear resos and G2 clear batters. What helped me make the decision to use the EC2 coated heads was that I just wanted a different sound. What I did was I put an EC2 coated on the 12" tom, a G2 coated on the 13" and kept the G2 clear on the 16" floor tom. This way I was able to make an educated decision on how the different heads affected the sounds of my drums. It was unanimous, the EC2 coated heads won in this instance.

    BTW, I still love to hear the full resonance and great rich boisterous tones that the Evans G1 clear resos and G2 clear batters have to offer on my Bubinga and Maple kits.

    Dennis

  14. #14

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Quote Originally Posted by Beave View Post
    I had coated ec2's on my saturns but the 12'' tom sounded dead as well. I put clear Emporers on them and they all sound great now. Plenty of resonance and still a nice, deep tone.
    Case in point. My Saturns came with Emperors on the top and Ambassadors on the bottom. G2 clears are the equivalent if I'm not mistaken. That is what is on my TAMA bubinga's and will probably stay.

    So far I like my SONOR Maples and my DW Maples with Coated Ambassadors best. My Pearl Masters have clear G2's on them now cuz I like to see the black hardware against the maple but Coated Ambassadors are great on them, too.
    Signature here

  15. #15

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    I had a 10" tom that defied tuning, no matter what head choice. I did two things:

    •With all the hardware stripped off, and the drum down to a shell, hold it up with two fingers and strike the shell. On a piano, see hat note that tom is resonanting on or near, and tune to that note. the 10" was a C#

    •I know there are a lot of dd haters, but the Drumdial helped me to get that 10" singing when nothing else could. Assuring that all the lugs are tuned to the exact same tension might be what you need. I thought I was great at tuning, and the dd showed me how far off I was.

    Hope this helps
    And the trees are all kept equal by hatchet, axe, and saw. . .

  16. #16

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Geez with all the trouble you are having I would be checking if you have an out of round issue or an uneven bearing edge issue with the shell. With Tama Bubingas there should not be this much issue trying to get a sound out of it with any head. If you suspect the room take the drum to another and try tuning it there or shift the drumset in the room it is in. You could also try taking it to a music store and have them professionally tune it for you. Somewhere between the reso and the batter something ain't jivin... OR, It could also be that they sound fine. As you said recorded and when you put your head near the drum they sound fine. It may just be where you are sitting is a dead spot. How do others feel your drums sound? Have some one else play them while you stand out in the room. If you are in a band and plan to play out some day you should not get to hung up on what you are hearing sitting on the throne but what you are projecting to the audience and through the PA. Just my opinion here.
    Last edited by Timmkatt; 01-25-2009 at 02:04 PM.

  17. #17

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    I agree, usually a 12 is one of the easy drums to tune? I use EC on mine and it sounds great, I bet the shell is out of round or the bearing edge is messed up...There is nothing wrong with EC-2 Heads, is basically a G2 Clear with that ring inside..Check that drum out

  18. #18

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Quote Originally Posted by Larrysperf View Post
    tELL dEAN bUTTERWORTH THAT
    Who?

  19. #19

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Quote Originally Posted by Bish View Post

    So far I like my SONOR Maples and my DW Maples with Coated Ambassadors best.
    Eventually slap some REMO DW heads on those dubs and see if I don't speak the truth about Drum Workshop's heads sounding the best on Drum Workshop drums. Not saying your dubs don't sound good. The DW Remos just seat better on DW bearing edges. -Les sorry.. this was kinda off topic..

  20. #20

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Quote Originally Posted by Larrysperf View Post
    tELL dEAN bUTTERWORTH THAT
    Yeah..Mrs. Butterworth's old man.. mmm pancakes -Les

  21. #21
    Larrysperf Guest

    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Dean Butterworth plays bubingas and ec2. I think you have a bad bearing edge or somthings amiss. Nuff Said

  22. #22

    User Info Menu

    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    THIS DEAN BUTTERWORTH?

    Those dont look like EC2's to me.

  23. #23

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    Quote Originally Posted by Timmkatt View Post
    With Tama Bubingas there should not be this much issue trying to get a sound out of it with any head.
    Bish owns a set of these and said that they are finnicky with regards to head selection..- Les

  24. #24

    User Info Menu

    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    If you want more resonance go with a G-1 clear botton, G-1 clear top and get some Even O's or weatherstriping to controll decay and overtones

    This is a great guide to head selection and tuning.

    http://home.earthlink.net/~prof.sound/


    I find the smaller the tom the easier to tune also.
    Last edited by Cant Get Enough; 02-01-2009 at 10:46 PM.

  25. #25

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    Default Re: 12" Tom....

    I had EC2 coated heads on a Yamaha Recording Custom kit with dampener rings and they sounded sweet. I wanted a bit more ring, so I tried the EC2 clears. The 12 and 14 sounded amazing, but the 10 went completely dead. I used a Drum Dial to make sure everything was even, but to no avail. I ended up going back to the coated heads and everything was fine again. Frustrating.

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