Why ????

[1E&Ah2E]

I need something... I got to get this off chest, maybe youz can explain it or help me. I hope.

I started playing the drums daily in high school around age 16 & till age 23ish in that time frame took a couple lesson read a couple books, etc.

I picked the sticks back up about 2 1/2 years ago.

To this day there is not one a song I can play from start to finish. I keep good time to the radio, Cd's, & metronme. I can play the proper beat (imatate the groove) to many, many, many, songs. Radio on or off. And/or I can wing just about everything as long as I don't deviate from the groove.

With the radio off & me just jamming I can buzz around the kit singles, doubles, paradiddles, rudiments 8th notes, 16th, etc. hands & foot.

Its really starting to bug me.

Take for instance the album "Back in Black". I can play the album, if I just keep the groove & time to the songs. As soon as I try to mimic a fill or even put In my own, I loose track and screw it all up, but if I rewind to that fill, listen to it a couple times shut the radio off, I can do it, just not put it in the right place of the song or put it in the song.

Help !! advise !!!! execises !!!! drills !!!!!! something !!!
Thank you, its driving me crazy.

[funkyruss]

do you have a metronome? can u do a fill and come back to the beat on time? can you not hear when doing the fill while playing along with tunes?

[Warren Wright]

For instance: have you tried playing a slow blues tune and with headphones on and at a volume that allows you to hear the music louder than your drums are? Or played a slow ballad ? Or a simple straight 8th note patterned rock or country tune? If so, are you able to play simple fills on those tunes?

[late8]

I'm with funkyruss on this. A metronome will help in this regard if you haven't spent much time syncronizing your 'internal' clock. Some drummers have natural timing instincts where fills come easy and may never rely on a metronome for practice. I find myself having to re-connect with a metronome to keep my timing honest. My most obvious timing error is rushing a fill and the only way I stay consistant is practicing with a metronome.

[Pearl MCX Man]

I agree with Warren play slow songs. Sorry guys but a metronome for me never worked. I have tried it and just can't follow it. I am a self taught drummer and never used books etc. So I guess everyone is different like late said each drummer has his own timing instinct.

[1E&Ah2E]

I use a metronome when I go threw my rudiments & stuff, everyday.

Maybe if I can get some anwers to these:
Say there are 3 songs or 5 or 10 do you learn them one at a time ?

How long do you devote to one before you move to the next ?

Maybe I'm going at it all wrong.

[late8]

I use a metronome when I go threw my rudiments & stuff, everyday.

Maybe if I can get some anwers to these:
Say there are 3 songs or 5 or 10 do you learn them one at a time ?

How long do you devote to one before you move to the next ?

Maybe I'm going at it all wrong.

Hard to gauge how quickly others grasp onto something new. No right or wrong way, just what works for you. I try to learn at least 3 songs during practice time. Some songs are easier to figure out than others. How long to I devote to one song before moving on? Until I can play the key drum phrasing without thinking about it and that could be over several practices that span at least 90 minutes each.

[1E&Ah2E]

Late8, so you take them one at a time ?

[funkyruss]

If i was you, i'd do them 1 at a time...or perhaps til ya get sick of it for the day, then go to the next one, but remind yourself, I'm just gonna have fun with this next tune, just a loose jam with you and the song, not gonna"learn this one today...go back to 1st song next session/sessions, nail it, move to song 2....
How's that sound?

[funkyruss]

I agree with Warren play slow songs. Sorry guys but a metronome for me never worked. I have tried it and just can't follow it. I am a self taught drummer and never used books etc. So I guess everyone is different like late said each drummer has his own timing instinct.

being self taught has nothing to do with metronome usage....i also am self taught, and like Late8, i find i do also have to "check in" with my metronome on occasion, just to reign it in, if ya will...

[slinglander]

Best I can figure is you are loosing track of time with the fill. This means you don't yet have a feel for the time taken for your single or double rolls, etc. This is not unusual. This is the toughest part of dumming: fitting fills into the time of the song. Every drummer eventually develops his own sense of time and what fills work for their style. Case in point: some drummers start a fill with a 9 stroke roll or 1/2 paradiddle(a diddle?) which leads to a bunch of single strokes and doubles. That initial roll has to be fit into the song time which demands the drummer to be up to speed for that roll and be able to subconsciously count the time for that roll too. You could count the beats as you add a fill. Usually tho, you have to be able to play fairly well before you can do that!
I would suggest playing a simple slow roll for a count of 3 beats. When you can do that roll without counting double it for the same time frame.
Another time exercise is to play 9 stroke singles and follow it with a 9 stroke double that matches the singles' time. You get a feel for the elapsed time for one which has to be matched by the other.
A metronome might not be much help for short, fast rolls but should be useful for timing the entire fill.
Eventually you get the feel for elapsed 4/4 time and it becomes a subconscious thing. Then you tackle odd times and have to start all over with the counting system!

[Aviator42009]

It's easy to set the metronome to something like a cowbell or a bass. You wouldn't ignore your fellow musician's timing, would you? Much easier than that annoying click.

I too have problems playing along to music. I can get the beats down fine but if I don't have fills down it screws with my mind. And its so annoying to learn songs nearly perfect, really discourages me from covering songs sometimes.

[Pearl MCX Man]

being self taught has nothing to do with metronome usage....i also am self taught, and like Late8, i find i do also have to "check in" with my metronome on occasion, just to reign it in, if ya will...

Sorry I should of just said that I have no use for a metronome. I just count it in my head.

[1E&Ah2E]

Thanks for the input.

From what I gathered in your replies is:

take on one song at a time
(I usually listen and play along to between 5 & 10 on Cd, only once, then get POed and go channel surfing on the radio)(I caught myself keeping a beat to a timberlake song & a lady Gaga one yesterday before I posted this, )

Sync the beats & fills together.

Case in point: some drummers start a fill with a 9 stroke roll or 1/2 paradiddle(a diddle?)

Is that inside an eighth note, slinger ? (between the beeps of the metronome)

[Digital]

I'm not sure how helpful this will be, but whatever.

I find that I usually play better and more on-time if I don't hear my own drums as much when I play along to a recording. I turn up the song's volume to slightly overpower my own drums and find that I make far fewer mistakes. I guess hearing myself too loudly makes me self concious in a way and I overthink things too much, when I know I can play the song almost perfectly.

[slinglander]

"Is that inside an eighth note, slinger ? (between the beeps of the metronome)"
probably 16ths or a buzz roll and one "beep" or even 1-1/2 of the 4 count. Buzz rolls are very accommodating or adaptive....

I think I know what you're asking: where or when might this occur in a fill? I'm guessing here: at the start (or at the first beat of the measure).

[late8]

Late8, so you take them one at a time ?

Yes, one at a time.

[1E&Ah2E]

I played "Simple Man" by skynard about 10 times today and "back in black" by AC/DC 7 times. I noticed something. Its the little touchy fills. The ones that are between the hat, snare, & bass. The ones that break up the beat and grab attention. I'm not sure if they have a name. I replaced those parts with a simple 8th note paradiddle on the snare it came out okay. Its to repetitive that way but, as for self confidence its great.
All these years I messed around with 8th, 16th, triplets, paradiddles, drags,
pata-fla-fla's and what not.
Its all kinda useless, if I don't apply it and learn some songs.

[funkyruss]

Drink some red wine, then try again, make sure you're having fun, feel the beat in your guts....i done nuthin and i'm all outta ideas

[1E&Ah2E]

Taking them one at a time is the way to go, funky. It was a best time i ever had playing to a CD. They kept on getting better the more times I played them.
No red wine its 2,000 degrees outside & 88 in my cellar...ice cold rolling rock.

[funkyruss]

Taking them one at a time is the way to go, funky. It was a best time i ever had playing to a CD. They kept on getting better the more times I played them.
No red wine its 2,000 degrees outside & 88 in my cellar...ice cold rolling rock.

Ya, red wine... what was i thinking? I'm ok now... Ever so glad its coming around for you!

[itchie]

I noticed something. Its the little touchy fills. The ones that are between the hat, snare, & bass. The ones that break up the beat and grab attention. I'm not sure if they have a name.

they are called ghost or grace notes, depending on what side of the globe you come from

All these years I messed around with 8th, 16th, triplets, paradiddles, drags,
pata-fla-fla's and what not.
Its all kinda useless, if I don't apply it and learn some songs.

thats for stick control and wrist strengthening ask some of the older guys even after 30+ years of playing you will still use the first 20 rudiments ..

I honestly think because its been a while the muscles need to be reprogrammed, also what could be a issue is only having a few lessons you where never forced into a healthy practice routine ,

[slinglander]

Check out free lessons online for a bit on ghost notes. The easiest are actually a combo of ride singles and snare(left hand) starting with left on the snare a 5 stroke roll between the hats or ride and the snare: snare-ride-snare-ride-snare( ends on the beat).
Hope that helps. Hear that a lot on classic rock/blues rock songs-almost a standard thing.

[kyle102565]

study the pataflafa


guaranteed it will help.

go back to the rudiments, they bored me for months but i can throw a flam in when i want

[1E&Ah2E]

Its coming around.. I never devoted time to one song over and over and over...
Just like learning anything you have to practice it. Plus access to the sheet music helps.